From sloshy45@sbcglobal.net Sun Aug 1 01:07:22 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EAA987501B2 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 01:07:21 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.276 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.276 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=0.723, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001] autolearn=no Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fQqeJ9y0HXFx for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 01:07:20 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp105.sbc.mail.ac4.yahoo.com (smtp105.sbc.mail.ac4.yahoo.com [76.13.13.244]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 88D45750140 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 01:07:11 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 89357 invoked from network); 1 Aug 2010 01:07:09 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=sbcglobal.net; h=DKIM-Signature:Received:X-Yahoo-SMTP:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=vwrWz5E+ffyoEBmCjpGtUNcmULfqQaa7NHT8fC/GXCyuweWVwI45an9bowcuuyWOvuB3nstHvnCFTwoDXx69HHMon7uOFsmme9GX0TlyBSKSp7e33yMaczA2+WhYu4ua0b4W93qXMyG1DZcdXi/fd+2i17se2ELNWcWlYOrzvwo= ; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=sbcglobal.net; s=s1024; t=1280624829; bh=+AmeWTFz2+hnWiP6x3ztLuQhYq7ipA4gcfEOvrUEgpo=; h=Received:X-Yahoo-SMTP:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=QBt8Jf1lX18LdJQk3xVY1UL1PrJKSNzTis5W9fmw6a1UfdqTsW/7Nt71dGnLiPLiWqAW9g2O04bWNpNExQYlD/uE1ju4gSf9xqht2Q8lp9ZvbE6N4eBd92YAyJV2xG+4Xvy+7wtvdqi74YyrIdD+1C8WSyHWz6E35DKpsWyAS38= Received: from [192.168.1.118] (sloshy45@99.140.202.33 with plain) by smtp105.sbc.mail.ac4.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jul 2010 18:07:08 -0700 PDT X-Yahoo-SMTP: OhstvuiswBBz7FeX8HKAFDd.RuNJU6P8idCqCh6OCFkheW0- X-YMail-OSG: 6s3birIVM1nz4HjPTmUsaDeuZG_CXEtPH7lp5iQTbmU2c_m Bfxnanz3dZuRYFc.1Fy7cPAVg9J1O3taWAigrE07DcTrwYzaRFfGGjCidn1f 6zLHSOTp27QpzJwQ5Le8jQMhDftIjyaW.B6hUpXkc987a8IbSaY9TkLPab.o kxECbPX4RB4KENVP4Yvq7mJCgT_0_ePpHpGCdJzlKkLallWoQbKf4hYrVgKE APCx2S7YcHp8OLZ8__YlfQfDOffSGmYF1Eg-- X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Message-ID: <4C54C8BC.3090800@sbcglobal.net> Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2010 20:07:08 -0500 From: Ryan Peters User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.9.2.7) Gecko/20100720 Lanikai/3.1.1 ThunderBrowse/3.3.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Sean Dunwoody , gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Subject: Re: some thoughts on gnome shell References: <4C53B9BF.20104@smit.id.au> <4C5440B2.1060403@sbcglobal.net> <424762.34017.qm@web24208.mail.ird.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <424762.34017.qm@web24208.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2010 01:07:22 -0000 On 07/31/2010 04:52 PM, Sean Dunwoody wrote:

"Note that GNOME Shell will look much different in the future, and the menus you find hard to navigate (in this example, the applications menu) will be much easier to navigate."

Is Gnome Shell really going to look like that when it's released? I was just starting to appreciate how it works and looks now :-/

On a side note that mockup looks a LOT like Unity . . .

-Sean

Yeah, it does a bit. I do see quite a few differences though:
(Note that this comparison is based on current screenshots/mockups/design information, and things might change in the future).

The Application switcher only appears when you open the overlay in GNOME Shell, while it stays visible in Unity. I prefer GNOME Shell's approach because it saves more horizontal space (crucial for netbooks).
Unity still keeps application indicators in the same area as system indicators, while GNOME Shell has system indicators only on the top panel, reducing application "indicators" to notification/status icons in the notification tray (accessed by moving your mouse to the bottom right corner of the screen). GNOME Shell is much more organized, so I prefer its style again.
Unity uses NotifyOSD for its notifications, while GNOME Shell has its own notification system. GNOME Shell's notifications are small vertically and expand when you move your mouse over them; you can see past notifications by looking in the notification tray. NotifyOSD has semi-transparent notifications in the top-right corner that blur when you move your mouse over them. They are un-clickable and provide no functionality over Shell's notifications; you can't even access a log of your past notifications.
GNOME Shell features an interface switcher that makes it easy to spatially organize your running applications. Unity has no workspace switcher, and instead focuses on the currently running application window.
GNOME Shell's top bar is organized as follows: Activities button, Application menu, Clock (always in the center), Symbolic icons ("System indicators"), user menu. Unity's bar is as follows (this is subject to change, so I'm leaving out what I'm not sure will be there): Ubuntu button/logo, Indicators, Time, MeMenu, Power Menu. GNOME Shell has an advantage here because the clock is always in the center, while for Unity it is awkwardly placed in-between other panel items.
GNOME Shell is easily theme-able, while Unity has not announced any information on theme-ing as far as I know.

I hate to sound like I'm bashing Unity, but GNOME Shell (at the very moment, at least) seems like a much better choice for both desktops as well as netbooks and small-screen devices. Shell is also developed by more organizations and companies than Unity and is more "upstream".

- Ryan Peters

PS: Just thought I should say that I am in no way affiliated with the GNOME Shell development or design team, and I can't speak for them. My emails are my own observations and opinions from what I know so far and should not be taken as the opinions and observations of anybody officially involved with the projects I mention.
From merkinman@hotmail.com Sun Aug 1 01:35:17 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27085750079 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 01:35:17 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -99.98 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-99.98 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, FREEMAIL_REPLY=1.929, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] autolearn=no Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tCEb23JDJKl7 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 01:35:13 +0000 (UTC) Received: from snt0-omc4-s38.snt0.hotmail.com (snt0-omc4-s38.snt0.hotmail.com [65.55.90.241]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C15C75010A for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 01:35:05 +0000 (UTC) Received: from SNT106-W18 ([65.55.90.200]) by snt0-omc4-s38.snt0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Sat, 31 Jul 2010 18:35:03 -0700 Message-ID: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_274c9b7c-655c-42b5-ae9b-c791f74ed1ce_" X-Originating-IP: [76.98.124.101] From: Mark Curtis To: Subject: RE: some thoughts on gnome shell Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2010 21:35:03 -0400 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <4C54C8BC.3090800@sbcglobal.net> References: <4C53B9BF.20104@smit.id.au> <4C5440B2.1060403@sbcglobal.net>, <424762.34017.qm@web24208.mail.ird.yahoo.com>, <4C54C8BC.3090800@sbcglobal.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Aug 2010 01:35:03.0424 (UTC) FILETIME=[C3827000:01CB3119] X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2010 01:35:17 -0000 --_274c9b7c-655c-42b5-ae9b-c791f74ed1ce_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable (Note that this comparison is based on current screenshots/mockups/design i= nformation=2C and things might change in the future).The Application switch= er only appears when you open the overlay in GNOME Shell=2C while it stays = visible in Unity. With Unity applications are available without user intera= ction and require less mouse movement to manageUnity still keeps applicatio= n indicators in the same area as system indicators=2C while GNOME Shell has= system indicators only on the top panel=2C reducing application "indicator= s" to notification/status icons in the notification tray (accessed by movin= g your mouse to the bottom right corner of the screen). Unity provides one = area to look for changes=2C whether they are system wide or application spe= cific.Unity uses NotifyOSD for its notifications=2C while GNOME Shell has i= ts own notification system. GNOME Shell's notifications are small verticall= y and expand when you move your mouse over them=3B capturing your mouse if = you're doing something else on the bottom of the screen. Left unattended th= e lower right piles up with unread notifications=2C forcing you to manage e= very little change. NotifyOSD has semi-transparent notifications in the top= -right corner that blur when you move your mouse over them. NotifyOSD is me= ant to be just that=2C a notification=2C completely unobtrusive and not dem= anding on attention. Also it appears in the consistent location of the uppe= r right cornerGNOME Shell features an interface switcher that makes it easy= to spatially organize your running applications. Unity has no workspace sw= itcher=2C and instead focuses on the currently running application window g= iven that it is geared towards netbooks and zooming out all windows and wor= kspaces would prove too small for a netbook screen.GNOME Shell's top bar is= organized as follows: Activities button=2C Application menu=2C Clock (alwa= ys in the center)=2C Symbolic icons ("System indicators")=2C user menu. Uni= ty's bar is as follows (this is subject to change=2C so I'm leaving out wha= t I'm not sure will be there): Ubuntu button/logo=2C Global Menu=2C Indicat= or applet.(it's funny how for Shell you group everything for "System Indica= tors" yet individually spell them out for Unity=2C giving the appearance Un= ity has more clutter)GNOME Shell is easily theme-able=2C while Unity has no= t announced any information on theme-ing as far as I know.(does not mean it= won't happen) There=2C I kept the factual stuff and completely reversed the opinions so i= t's in the favor of Unity. :P With that out of the way=2C and getting this less about Unity=2C is there a= time frame for when elements of the GNOME Shell mockup with start to show = up? Date: Sat=2C 31 Jul 2010 20:07:08 -0500 From: sloshy45@sbcglobal.net To: sean_dunwoody@yahoo.com=3B gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Subject: Re: some thoughts on gnome shell =20 =20 Message body =20 =20 On 07/31/2010 04:52 PM=2C Sean Dunwoody wrote: =20 =20 "Note that GNOME Shell will look much different in the future=2C and the menus you find hard to navigate (in this example=2C the applications menu) will be much easier to navigate." =20 =20 Is Gnome Shell really going to look like that when it's released? I was just starting to appreciate how it works and looks now :-/ =20 On a side note that mockup looks a LOT like Unity . . . =20 -Sean =20 =20 =20 =20 =20 Yeah=2C it does a bit. I do see quite a few differences though: (Note that this comparison is based on current screenshots/mockups/design information=2C and things might change in the future). =20 The Application switcher only appears when you open the overlay in GNOME Shell=2C while it stays visible in Unity. I prefer GNOME Shell's approach because it saves more horizontal space (crucial for netbooks). Unity still keeps application indicators in the same area as system indicators=2C while GNOME Shell has system indicators only on the top panel=2C reducing application "indicators" to notification/status icons in the notification tray (accessed by moving your mouse to the bottom right corner of the screen). GNOME Shell is much more organized=2C so I prefer its style again. Unity uses NotifyOSD for its notifications=2C while GNOME Shell has its own notification system. GNOME Shell's notifications are small vertically and expand when you move your mouse over them=3B you can see past notifications by looking in the notification tray. NotifyOSD has semi-transparent notifications in the top-right corner that blur when you move your mouse over them. They are un-clickable and provide no functionality over Shell's notifications=3B you can't even access a log of your past notifications. GNOME Shell features an interface switcher that makes it easy to spatially organize your running applications. Unity has no workspace switcher=2C and instead focuses on the currently running application window. GNOME Shell's top bar is organized as follows: Activities button=2C Application menu=2C Clock (always in the center)=2C Symbo= lic icons ("System indicators")=2C user menu. Unity's bar is as follows (this is subject to change=2C so I'm leaving out what I'm not sure will be there): Ubuntu button/logo=2C Indicators=2C Time= =2C MeMenu=2C Power Menu. GNOME Shell has an advantage here because the clock is always in the center=2C while for Unity it is awkwardly placed in-between other panel items. GNOME Shell is easily theme-able=2C while Unity has not announced any information on theme-ing as far as I know. =20 I hate to sound like I'm bashing Unity=2C but GNOME Shell (at the very moment=2C at least) seems like a much better choice for both desktops as well as netbooks and small-screen devices. Shell is also developed by more organizations and companies than Unity and is more "upstream". =20 - Ryan Peters =20 PS: Just thought I should say that I am in no way affiliated with the GNOME Shell development or design team=2C and I can't speak for them. My emails are my own observations and opinions from what I know so far and should not be taken as the opinions and observations of anybody officially involved with the projects I mention. =20 _______________________________________________ gnome-shell-list mailing list gnome-shell-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list = --_274c9b7c-655c-42b5-ae9b-c791f74ed1ce_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable = (Note that this comparison is based on current screenshots/mockups/design i= nformation=2C and things might change in the future).

The Application switcher only appears when you open the = overlay in GNOME Shell=2C while it stays visible in Unity. With Unity appli= cations are available without user interaction and require less mouse movem= ent to manage
Unity still= keeps application indicators in the same area as system indicators=2C whil= e GNOME Shell has system indicators only on the top panel=2C reducing appli= cation "indicators" to notification/status icons in the notification tray (= accessed by moving your mouse to the bottom right corner of the screen). Un= ity provides one area to look for changes=2C whether they are system wide o= r application specific.
U= nity uses NotifyOSD for its notifications=2C while GNOME Shell has its own = notification system. GNOME Shell's notifications are small vertically and e= xpand when you move your mouse over them=3B capturing your mouse if you're = doing something else on the bottom of the screen. Left unattended the lower= right piles up with unread =3Bnotifications=2C forcing you to manage e= very little change. NotifyOSD has semi-transparent notifications in the top= -right corner that blur when you move your mouse over them. NotifyOSD is me= ant to be just that=2C a notification=2C completely =3Bunobtrusive = =3Band not demanding on attention. Also it appears in the consistent locati= on of the upper right corner
GNOME Shell features an interface switcher that makes it easy to spat= ially organize your running applications. Unity has no workspace switcher= =2C and instead focuses on the currently running application window given t= hat it is geared towards netbooks and zooming out all windows and workspace= s would prove too small for a netbook screen.
GNOME Shell's top bar is organized as follows: Activit= ies button=2C Application menu=2C Clock (always in the center)=2C Symbolic = icons ("System indicators")=2C user menu. Unity's bar is as follows (this i= s subject to change=2C so I'm leaving out what I'm not sure will be there):= Ubuntu button/logo=2C Global Menu=2C Indicator applet.(it's funny how for = Shell you group everything for "System Indicators" yet individually spell t= hem out for Unity=2C giving the appearance Unity has more clutter)
GNOME Shell is easily theme-able= =2C while Unity has not announced any information on theme-ing as far as I = know.(does not mean it won't happen)

There=2C = I kept the factual stuff and completely reversed the =3Bopinions = =3Bso it's in the favor of Unity. :P

With that out= of the way=2C and getting this less about Unity=2C is there a time frame f= or when elements of the GNOME Shell mockup with start to show up?

Date: Sat=2C 31 Jul 2010 20:07:08 -0500
From: sl= oshy45@sbcglobal.net
To: sean_dunwoody@yahoo.com=3B gnome-shell-list@gno= me.org
Subject: Re: some thoughts on gnome shell

=20 =20 Message body =20 =20 On 07/31/2010 04:52 PM=2C Sean Dunwoody wrote:

"Note that GNOME Shell will look much different in the future=2C and the menus you find hard to navigate (in this example=2C the applications menu) will be much easier to navigate."

Is Gnome Shell really going to look like that when it's released? I was just starting to appreciate how it works and looks now :-/

On a side note that mockup looks a LOT like Unity . . .

-Sean

Yeah=2C it does a bit. I do see quite a few differences though:
(Note that this comparison is based on current screenshots/mockups/design information=2C and things might change in the future).

The Application switcher only appears when you open the overlay in GNOME Shell=2C while it stays visible in Unity. I prefer GNOME Shell's approach because it saves more horizontal space (crucial for netbooks).
Unity still keeps application indicators in the same area as system indicators=2C while GNOME Shell has system indicators only on the top panel=2C reducing application "indicators" to notification/status icons in the notification tray (accessed by moving your mouse to the bottom right corner of the screen). GNOME Shell is much more organized=2C so I prefer its style again.<= /li>
Unity uses NotifyOSD for its notifications=2C while GNOME Shell has its own notification system. GNOME Shell's notifications are small vertically and expand when you move your mouse over them=3B you can see past notifications by looking in the notification tray. NotifyOSD has semi-transparent notifications in the top-right corner that blur when you move your mouse over them. They are un-clickable and provide no functionality over Shell's notifications=3B you can't even access a log of your past notifications.
GNOME Shell features an interface switcher that makes it easy to spatially organize your running applications. Unity has no workspace switcher=2C and instead focuses on the currently running application window.
GNOME Shell's top bar is organized as follows: Activities button=2C Application menu=2C Clock (always in the center)=2C Symbo= lic icons ("System indicators")=2C user menu. Unity's bar is as follows (this is subject to change=2C so I'm leaving out what I'm not sure will be there): Ubuntu button/logo=2C Indicators=2C Time= =2C MeMenu=2C Power Menu. GNOME Shell has an advantage here because the clock is always in the center=2C while for Unity it is awkwardly placed in-between other panel items.
GNOME Shell is easily theme-able=2C while Unity has not announced any information on theme-ing as far as I know.

I hate to sound like I'm bashing Unity=2C but GNOME Shell (at the very moment=2C at least) seems like a much better choice for both desktops as well as netbooks and small-screen devices. Shell is also developed by more organizations and companies than Unity and is more "upstream".

=3B =3B =3B - Ryan Peters

PS: Just thought I should say that I am in no way affiliated with the GNOME Shell development or design team=2C and I can't speak for them. My emails are my own observations and opinions from what I know so far and should not be taken as the opinions and observations of anybody officially involved with the projects I mention.
=20
_______________________________________________ gnome-shell-list mailing list gnome-shell-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list = --_274c9b7c-655c-42b5-ae9b-c791f74ed1ce_-- From barra78@gmail.com Sun Aug 1 07:46:29 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3CD27750204 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 07:46:29 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.447 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.447 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=1.553, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dw3FnO6c-0zm for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 07:46:26 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-iw0-f182.google.com (mail-iw0-f182.google.com [209.85.214.182]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68628750140 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 07:46:18 +0000 (UTC) Received: by iwn35 with SMTP id 35so4079336iwn.27 for ; Sun, 01 Aug 2010 00:46:16 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:received:in-reply-to :references:date:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=OV59/1b7baY4hpaW/ignDszSPWWtnp9DlMU+LMGsdWA=; b=fddMrgLrgFRwypnyyuTb9P8iR9pWYczWY/7X2k8bFXBXlwcJktNbiC6ekjZm3P6bJZ 9TqyvUTOnmNBH2r9Lme4TkZRQCWk2V0cQd33hrOeTvSIaZ+UpfoWCN3g1kkHEzq2pa7A bunD5G0kzIQnWljy7twmBz/71wPRqTlCQ19qU= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; b=Uvo+r+vBehfQlJv+pTr/Y7f9DM0S6ao6jafV0xuF8OkgUYh1N98u8T/S9aJGQd9baG znHZSEQEwJL7Ur26KBPn8sxitFWBsMoG77cFgVDQbw10BMVC2sSPCthZCTJN492TWhCn zoGfiVFBw1bQwJuFZ3GMUl5YXXcI8ATtbPE9g= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.231.173.9 with SMTP id n9mr4679086ibz.146.1280648776424; Sun, 01 Aug 2010 00:46:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.184.146 with HTTP; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 00:46:16 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <4C546C3F.1060606@sbcglobal.net> References: <4C53B9BF.20104@smit.id.au> <4C5440B2.1060403@sbcglobal.net> <4C546C3F.1060606@sbcglobal.net> Date: Sun, 1 Aug 2010 09:46:16 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: Re: some thoughts on gnome shell From: Barra To: Ryan Peters Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Cc: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2010 07:46:29 -0000 @Ryan ok, notifications are now "less intrusive" but the problem remains: the third image (http://live.gnome.org/GnomeShell/Design/Guidelines/MessageTray/Chat) messages are too big and if I'm working on a another program. Notify OSD gives less problems because this does not invade the main area of the screen. TODAY the solution proposed by Canonical application indicators and system indicators seem easier to use. If I'm not in front of the computer and I get a notification (from telepathy) in gnome-shell that is visible only if I'm going to search them right? Canonical addition to notify-osd use other instruments (me-or sound-applet2 menu for example) to provide a proper control system. Zeitgeist:The problem is not the UI but the code that deals with the research. If I type in gnome-do "you" the first result is because the terminal use this program daily. Gnome-shell offers me the client terminal server, a program that I never use! Zeitgeist fix this limit Application menu: The choice to use the favorites is IMHO a wrong choice. The risk is that a "non-Power User" hard to find the necessary order to work. the learning curve is too high today in gnome-shell. I agree with those who say that "If somebody needs an extension or a gizmo to easily do a function, we've failed." Gnome3 MUST be usable by all without extensions, modifications, customizations. Today it is not even in the mockup and the situation does not seem much improved. Application switcher:I do not want to make judgments before you try the solution you are developing but the usual "not power users" expects to have on screen a list of open programs .... It 'so you always and I do not think that is willing to change medoto work for "your fault": P Clock: I'm sorry but I do not understand what the advantage of having the clock in the center of the screen: P I do not want to compete gnome-shell and unity but it is interesting to evaluate the choices made by teams very different. Both programs are also still under development and unity seems more "mature" and it will be released in October, gnome-shell (thankfully) was deferred. But often it seems that the team follows the development of gnome-shell tends to "obstinate" about their ideas, without assessing with due care proposals that come from outside. and for this reason that today, after more than two years of development is not yet well defined idea of how they will be future desktop gnome! Take it as constructive criticism but at Canonical have looked around, saw zeitgeist and mutter, have developed code for a month and have created something that is more "ready" gnome-shell. IMHO you should organize an event to sit and listen. People like Seif Lotfy, David Siegel, Andrea Cimitan, the people of elementary project can perhaps give some interesting gnome-shell to make something unique and great! From barra78@gmail.com Sun Aug 1 10:09:21 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED2BE7500B4 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 10:09:20 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.359 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.359 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=1.553, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, TW_GT=0.077, T_TO_NO_BRKTS_FREEMAIL=0.01] autolearn=no Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 78Y7fu8KKVT1 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 10:09:19 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-iw0-f182.google.com (mail-iw0-f182.google.com [209.85.214.182]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF13A750116 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 10:09:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: by iwn35 with SMTP id 35so4180631iwn.27 for ; Sun, 01 Aug 2010 03:09:09 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:received:date:message-id :subject:from:to:content-type; bh=DqGa2KQ4wTVpvdU/17J94PjtAmgNnVHPoFntOw4ltJI=; b=bnyIwXhjlNyLl0GDsylZM/vkGCsqiZ2xxpAB6dkCd5y0ILeSPzqCNUwptWO4WcDX4z npe2pZxw6bWG0h6nOetntc4REMe7+luGWuk7D6Z+OE4MxtFHAEjdELfxCB2W3ARzl+jR ayoZDh41m8VDf6m/QDjc4R3kqb3mSP1iRpxuo= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; b=wmqbbYwMnibLQKhhBZC1v8vIMkAFWatm4MPF7WF55MWNTU4F9iH98hrgxenFjPu0xo 70V5TNA7BNqVYkByo3aEOPMlTAf5wWkQfcfjhrxIzs3HK1Immylo/8NGl1he+5JMJGWg LnsLjE6mP1azyGCv3siokG0xn0x1CZ84PH30A= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.231.33.205 with SMTP id i13mr4850737ibd.179.1280657346449; Sun, 01 Aug 2010 03:09:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.184.146 with HTTP; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 03:09:06 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 1 Aug 2010 12:09:06 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: problem with git From: Barra To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=00221534c94f36d2bc048cc0464b X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2010 10:09:21 -0000 --00221534c94f36d2bc048cc0464b Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > *** Checking out gtk3 *** [8/21] > git clone git://git.gnome.org/gtk%2b gtk3 > Initialized empty Git repository in > /home/barra/gnome-shell/source/gtk3/.git/ > fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly > *** Error during phase checkout of gtk3: ########## Error running git clone > git://git.gnome.org/gtk%2b gtk3 *** [8/21] > is that some days I always get this error! -- Matteo Baranzoni barra78@gmail.com barra78@libero.it barra.mo@tiscalinet.it ICQ UIN:1287073 MSN: barra_78@hotmail.it --00221534c94f36d2bc048cc0464b Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

*** Checking out = gtk3 *** [8/21]
git clone git://= git.gnome.org/gtk%2b gtk3
Initialized empty Git repository in /home/barra/gnome-shell/source/gtk3/.gi= t/
fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly
*** Error during phase = checkout of gtk3: ########## Error running git clone git://git.gnome.org/gtk%2b gtk3 *** [8/21]

is that some days I always get this error!=
--
Matteo Baranzoni

bar= ra78@gmail.com
barra78@libero.it
barra.mo@tiscalinet.it

ICQ UIN:1287= 073
MSN: barra_78@hotmail.it<= br>
--00221534c94f36d2bc048cc0464b-- From uraharakisuke153@gmail.com Sun Aug 1 10:35:39 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 929E67500E3 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 10:35:39 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.36 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.36 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=1.553, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, TW_GT=0.077, T_TO_NO_BRKTS_FREEMAIL=0.01] autolearn=no Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ifhrXy0enFUV for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 10:35:37 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-qy0-f175.google.com (mail-qy0-f175.google.com [209.85.216.175]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9E957500DA for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 10:35:29 +0000 (UTC) Received: by qyk31 with SMTP id 31so5560622qyk.6 for ; Sun, 01 Aug 2010 03:35:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:subject:from:to:in-reply-to :references:content-type:date:message-id:mime-version:x-mailer :content-transfer-encoding; bh=ZX9TMVFe+6HXh2o71fbPIh4DV1a6k5ptfss5idWXkcw=; b=Gd4Um98Y3bvKpIPu9G2knyY5a2u88C3XYEGxczmztXzmYC2ZBPSkpmnWmo6UCei7Ns bOV+UEuK5tCYnp+bJE+GXJbmAobD07tAos4PsjW2m9YpyJ1y3C7OKS/U0n+HJF/pRBfA fczH2hSgnXuxKbQfu1yV91ZtwwpmBkDKXUt30= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=subject:from:to:in-reply-to:references:content-type:date:message-id :mime-version:x-mailer:content-transfer-encoding; b=fqCU9ct32bIIf3SPNUD/Qiv0+tRTYua0+kH9OvlwD821sIX5GoOqygSEgi0PRIx+67 9UYr6PALkwiBeSp5ZXMj/BSXl4HBmhPskhwkTKxr2AHR4tL97yYMuR5LwPklPOdCqQcD cEGxgP7IAohZ/SADFP05GcysV8fXjn/t/Vx4I= Received: by 10.220.125.38 with SMTP id w38mr3064657vcr.49.1280658927772; Sun, 01 Aug 2010 03:35:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.2.6] (c-98-236-157-248.hsd1.pa.comcast.net [98.236.157.248]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id v11sm4136784vbb.12.2010.08.01.03.35.25 (version=SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Sun, 01 Aug 2010 03:35:26 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: problem with git From: Virgil Brummond To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2010 06:35:24 -0400 Message-ID: <1280658924.4648.1.camel@pandora> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.28.3 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2010 10:35:39 -0000 >From Ubuntuforums: A workaround is to run: pushd ~/gnome-shell/source/ && git clone git://git.gnome.org/gtk+ gtk3 && popd It built for me, I also had this issue: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=623952 On Sun, 2010-08-01 at 12:09 +0200, Barra wrote: > *** Checking out gtk3 *** [8/21] > git clone git://git.gnome.org/gtk%2b gtk3 > Initialized empty Git repository > in /home/barra/gnome-shell/source/gtk3/.git/ > fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly > *** Error during phase checkout of gtk3: ########## Error > running git clone git://git.gnome.org/gtk%2b gtk3 *** [8/21] > > > is that some days I always get this error! > -- > Matteo Baranzoni > > barra78@gmail.com > barra78@libero.it > barra.mo@tiscalinet.it > > ICQ UIN:1287073 > MSN: barra_78@hotmail.it > > _______________________________________________ > gnome-shell-list mailing list > gnome-shell-list@gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list From jhs@jsschmid.de Sun Aug 1 13:24:06 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2046A7500E8 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 13:24:06 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.91 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.91 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Z5hpE4l9LVMu for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 13:24:02 +0000 (UTC) Received: from jsschmid.de (jsschmid.de [85.214.61.233]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B3867500ED for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 13:23:53 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [192.168.2.105] (p54BEB26B.dip.t-dialin.net [84.190.178.107]) by jsschmid.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 89E6E570039; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 13:23:50 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: some thoughts on gnome shell From: Johannes Schmid To: Barra In-Reply-To: References: <4C53B9BF.20104@smit.id.au> <4C5440B2.1060403@sbcglobal.net> <4C546C3F.1060606@sbcglobal.net> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-E6KKvPPDL45BFA/jN5cp" Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2010 15:23:44 +0200 Message-ID: <1280669024.2357.7.camel@Obelix> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.30.2 (2.30.2-1.fc13) Cc: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2010 13:24:06 -0000 --=-E6KKvPPDL45BFA/jN5cp Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi! > ok, notifications are now "less intrusive" but the problem remains: > the third image > (http://live.gnome.org/GnomeShell/Design/Guidelines/MessageTray/Chat) > messages are too big and if I'm working on a another program. This is only when you use the inline chat feature which means you already focused on the chat. Normally only a much smaller message will appear (see image one on mentioned page). > Notify > OSD gives less problems because this does not invade the main area of > the screen. TODAY the solution proposed by Canonical application > indicators and system indicators seem easier to use. If I'm not in > front of the computer and I get a notification (from telepathy) in > gnome-shell that is visible only if I'm going to search them right? > Canonical addition to notify-osd use other instruments (me-or > sound-applet2 menu for example) to provide a proper control system. The noticiations disappear after some time as Ubuntu. You can look for previous notifications if you move the mouse to the bottom of the screen. > Zeitgeist:The problem is not the UI but the code that deals with the rese= arch. > If I type in gnome-do "you" the first result is because the terminal > use this program daily. Gnome-shell offers me the client terminal > server, a program that I never use! Zeitgeist fix this limit That has nothing to do with zeitgeist and the search feature is being worked on so that it includes applications, documents, web sites, etc. > Application menu: The choice to use the favorites is IMHO a wrong choice. > The risk is that a "non-Power User" hard to find the necessary order > to work. the learning curve is too high today in gnome-shell. I agree > with those who say that "If somebody needs an extension or a gizmo to > easily do a function, we've failed." Gnome3 MUST be usable by all > without extensions, modifications, customizations. Today it is not > even in the mockup and the situation does not seem much improved. Trust me, lots of people use gnome-shell daily but there are areas that can be improved. I think the GUADEC mockup are not yet uploaded anywhere but I guess that will happen soon. The overlay is slightly redesigned there. > Application switcher:I do not want to make judgments before you try > the solution you are developing but the usual "not power users" > expects to have on screen a list of open programs .... It 'so you > always and I do not think that is willing to change medoto work for > "your fault": P The gnome-shell developers think that the applications switcher wastes screen space and I think they are right. Ever seen a phone with an application switcher? > IMHO you should organize an event to sit and listen. People like Seif > Lotfy, David Siegel, Andrea Cimitan, the people of elementary project > can perhaps give some interesting gnome-shell to make something unique > and great! Eh, yeah, that's why all of those attended GUADEC together with most of the gnome-shell developers. There is lots of discussion, still sometimes it's hard to understand some decisions Canonical did (behind closed doors). Johannes --=-E6KKvPPDL45BFA/jN5cp Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.14 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAkxVdWAACgkQAvZZn2XJ+bO5AwCfV60G7FkESP46nZ8RFXXmoUof g0YAoI4zBiC7QlUAED+u/pvmKuACEQ3S =MQ5m -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-E6KKvPPDL45BFA/jN5cp-- From lightstrike12345@hotmail.com Sun Aug 1 18:14:01 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A769E7500AD for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 18:14:01 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -98.802 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-98.802 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_05=-0.5, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=1.553, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, TW_GT=0.077, TW_JH=0.077, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] autolearn=no Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WsVxgwKqgcjk for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 18:14:00 +0000 (UTC) Received: from blu0-omc4-s6.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc4-s6.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.111.145]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0587A750077 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 18:13:51 +0000 (UTC) Received: from BLU0-SMTP40 ([65.55.111.136]) by blu0-omc4-s6.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Sun, 1 Aug 2010 11:13:49 -0700 X-Originating-IP: [209.195.65.56] X-Originating-Email: [lightstrike12345@hotmail.com] Message-ID: Received: from [192.168.0.101] ([209.195.65.56]) by BLU0-SMTP40.blu0.hotmail.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Sun, 1 Aug 2010 11:13:49 -0700 Subject: Re: problem with git From: Adam Gignac To: Virgil Brummond In-Reply-To: <1280658924.4648.1.camel@pandora> References: <1280658924.4648.1.camel@pandora> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=-kAARTLG+gkeq0OTQlsRA" Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2010 14:13:47 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.28.3 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Aug 2010 18:13:49.0299 (UTC) FILETIME=[4A1D4C30:01CB31A5] Cc: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2010 18:14:02 -0000 --=-kAARTLG+gkeq0OTQlsRA Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Sun, 2010-08-01 at 06:35 -0400, Virgil Brummond wrote: > > On Sun, 2010-08-01 at 12:09 +0200, Barra wrote: > > *** Checking out gtk3 *** [8/21] > > git clone git://git.gnome.org/gtk%2b gtk3 > > Initialized empty Git repository > > in /home/barra/gnome-shell/source/gtk3/.git/ > > fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly > > *** Error during phase checkout of gtk3: ########## Error > > running git clone git://git.gnome.org/gtk%2b gtk3 *** [8/21] > > > > > > is that some days I always get this error! > > -- > > Matteo Baranzoni > > If you look at the git line, the plus sign in gtk+ got corrupted into a "%2b". What I do is press 3(?) to open a shell when jhbuild prompts you, then run the git clone command manually. After that, just exit the shell and it'll continue compiling. ---------- To be or not to be, that is the bottom line. --=-kAARTLG+gkeq0OTQlsRA Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Sun, 2010-08-01 at 06:35 -0400, Virgil Brummond wrote:


On Sun, 2010-08-01 at 12:09 +0200, Barra wrote:
>         *** Checking out gtk3 *** [8/21]
>         git clone git://git.gnome.org/gtk%2b gtk3
>         Initialized empty Git repository
>         in /home/barra/gnome-shell/source/gtk3/.git/
>         fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly
>         *** Error during phase checkout of gtk3: ########## Error
>         running git clone git://git.gnome.org/gtk%2b gtk3 *** [8/21]
> 
> 
> is that some days I always get this error!
> -- 
> Matteo Baranzoni
>

If you look at the git line, the plus sign in gtk+ got corrupted into a "%2b". What I do is press 3(?) to open a shell when jhbuild prompts you, then run the git clone command manually. After that, just exit the shell and it'll continue compiling.

---------- To be or not to be, that is the bottom line.

--=-kAARTLG+gkeq0OTQlsRA-- From sean_dunwoody@yahoo.com Sun Aug 1 21:52:17 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D7F17500D3 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 21:52:17 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.008 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.008 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id g87X4+oFOVAI for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 21:52:14 +0000 (UTC) Received: from web24207.mail.ird.yahoo.com (web24207.mail.ird.yahoo.com [87.248.114.189]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 66AAB750107 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 21:52:04 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 2537 invoked by uid 60001); 1 Aug 2010 21:52:02 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s1024; t=1280699522; bh=eof/hI+gGC63Tgz1/hJFf02jtgrIPIxBarUxyhOLL8U=; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:References:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=qJX49raq6q4YoW3qawC4DD+DcYMKNYl/vCvcN2m6TyeNHzUmIVxsw47i153JAIEJOpsPoa9XjT5h723TaQQ88DcT/9CDUvGVvCJYpHbyiDbobgW26BDkT7SGfxzMVR6nAmVBO7BRMfunSc14cjpzWuSkj8wuXUijc6iWxXAHzrQ= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:References:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=n8yFRIj2S4Kb8dtN4NFHNVARF9QYGoGXHoE6Dwl3C+lhRdj0xswaDlSGbcskRmqCKmbkhQAq4EcqW7V6S7MVEMLd5NHLrOwQvOZPfWo5Tq9GMu6xSemzHr9bPJ+UYKnC4dRReCnwEnm2jhZHaHEmPlmJ9yKLiDu4S5UXQD5f5kw=; Message-ID: <713042.2145.qm@web24207.mail.ird.yahoo.com> X-YMail-OSG: 5h2eROQVM1lUWmIR3IxhSgGDZ7iT54Xp.avvsSlmXhyNY0g C6y2p5WjzK8NM.UeLJVGAtWiKSw_vxCLt24zM9oNPcbgcbTp13y67.uN0Aup CGpkb.mFk7i_wo.dJMbsNBORvtFB0axuUvb22rWEl9MUcBNK5ElLuc6owCa4 1IByFWiWbFkX_fu5CzXCCCuWOSuhVCZ8CJb8OPUJQ_AMgjXy9HYL3rBR5bE5 VU97jepvQ0ZjiNLDDXLj2oGeSP7pgZ4fbSsLB2if8jrBnc46KYKZZEuLLWkj EfA76aTKm Received: from [86.7.23.249] by web24207.mail.ird.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 01 Aug 2010 21:52:02 GMT X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/420.4 YahooMailWebService/0.8.105.279950 References: <4C53B9BF.20104@smit.id.au> <4C5440B2.1060403@sbcglobal.net> <424762.34017.qm@web24208.mail.ird.yahoo.com> <4C54C8BC.3090800@sbcglobal.net> Date: Sun, 1 Aug 2010 21:52:02 +0000 (GMT) From: Sean Dunwoody Subject: Re: some thoughts on gnome shell To: Ryan Peters , gnome-shell-list@gnome.org In-Reply-To: <4C54C8BC.3090800@sbcglobal.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-1454109906-1280699522=:2145" X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2010 21:52:17 -0000 --0-1454109906-1280699522=:2145 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I see advantages for both.=0A=0AAlso, my first question didn't really get a= nswered, is that really what the =0Ashell team is working towards? I'm just= a bit curious, and I can't see reason =0Abehind some of the changes :-/=0A= =0A-Sean=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFrom: Ryan Peters= =0ATo: Sean Dunwoody ; gn= ome-shell-list@gnome.org=0ASent: Sun, 1 August, 2010 2:07:08=0ASubject: Re:= some thoughts on gnome shell=0A=0A On 07/31/2010 04:52 PM, Sean Dunwoody w= rote: =0A"Note that GNOME Shell will look much differe= ntin =0Athe future, and the menus you find hard to navigate (in t= his example, =0Athe applications menu) will be much easier to = navigate."=0A>=0A>=0A>Is Gnome Shell really going to look like that = when it's released? I =0A>was just starting to appreciate how i= t works and looks now :-/=0A>=0A>On a side note that mockup loo= ks a LOT like Unity . . .=0A>=0A>-Sean=0A>=0A>=0AYeah, it does a bit. I do = see quite a few differences though:=0A(Note that this comparison is based o= n current screenshots/mockups/design =0Ainformation, and things might c= hange in the future).=0A=0A=09* The Application switcher only appears w= hen you open the overlay in =0AGNOME Shell, while it stays visible = in Unity. I prefer GNOME Shell's =0Aapproach because it saves more = horizontal space (crucial for netbooks).=0A=09* Unity still keeps a= pplication indicators in the same area as system =0Aindicators, whi= le GNOME Shell has system indicators only on the top =0Apanel, redu= cing application "indicators" to notification/status icons in =0Ath= e notification tray (accessed by moving your mouse to the bottom ri= ght =0Acorner of the screen). GNOME Shell is much more organized, s= o I prefer =0Aits style again.=0A=09* Unity uses NotifyOSD for its notifica= tions, while GNOME Shell has its =0Aown notification system. GNOME = Shell's notifications are small =0Avertically and expand when you m= ove your mouse over them; you can see =0Apast notifications by look= ing in the notification tray. NotifyOSD has =0Asemi-transparent not= ifications in the top-right corner that blur when =0Ayou move your = mouse over them. They are un-clickable and provide no =0Afunctional= ity over Shell's notifications; you can't even access a log of =0Ay= our past notifications.=0A=09* GNOME Shell features an interface sw= itcher that makes it easy to =0Aspatially organize your running app= lications. Unity has no workspace =0Aswitcher, and instead focuses = on the currently running application =0Awindow.=0A=09* GNOME Shell'= s top bar is organized as follows: Activities button, =0AApplicatio= n menu, Clock (always in the center), Symbolic icons ("System =0Ain= dicators"), user menu. Unity's bar is as follows (this is subject t= o =0Achange, so I'm leaving out what I'm not sure will be there): U= buntu =0Abutton/logo, Indicators, Time, MeMenu, Power Menu. GNOME S= hell has an =0Aadvantage here because the clock is always in the ce= nter, while for =0AUnity it is awkwardly placed in-between other pa= nel items.=0A=09* GNOME Shell is easily theme-able, while Unity has not = announced any =0Ainformation on theme-ing as far as I know.=0AI hate t= o sound like I'm bashing Unity, but GNOME Shell (at the very moment, = =0Aat least) seems like a much better choice for both desktops as well = as =0Anetbooks and small-screen devices. Shell is also developed by mor= e =0Aorganizations and companies than Unity and is more "upstream".=0A= =0A - Ryan Peters=0A=0APS: Just thought I should say that I am in no way= affiliated with the GNOME =0AShell development or design team, and I c= an't speak for them. My emails are =0Amy own observations and opinions = from what I know so far and should not be =0Ataken as the opinions and = observations of anybody officially involved with =0Athe projects I ment= ion.=0A=0A=0A=0A --0-1454109906-1280699522=:2145 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I see advantages for both.

Also, my first question= didn't really get answered, is that really what the shell team is working = towards? I'm just a bit curious, and I can't see reason behind some of the = changes :-/

-Sean

From: Ryan Peters <sloshy45@sbcglobal.net>
To: Sean Dunwoody <sean_dunwoody@yahoo.com>= ;; gnome-shell-list@gnome.org
Sent= : Sun, 1 August, 2010 2:07:08
Subject: Re: some thoughts on gnome shell

= =0A=0A =0A =0A =0A =0A On 07/31/2010 04:52 PM, Se= an Dunwoody wrote:=0A

=0A =0A
"Note that=0A GNOME Shell will=0A=0A look much different in=0A the future, and the menus = you find hard to navigate (in this=0A example, the applications me= nu) will be much easier to=0A navigate."
=0A
=0A

=0A Is= Gnome Shell really going to look like that when it's=0A release= d? I was just starting to appreciate how it works and=0A looks n= ow :-/
=0A
=0A On a side note that mockup look= s a LOT like Unity . . .
=0A
=0A -Sean
=0A =
=0A
=0A
=0A
=0A =0A Yeah, it does a bit. I do see quite a few differences though:=0A (Note that this comparison is based on current=0A screenshots/m= ockups/design information, and things might change in=0A the future).=0A
=0A
The Application switcher only appears when you ope= n the=0A overlay in GNOME Shell, while it stays visible in Unity. I= =0A prefer GNOME Shell's approach because it saves more horizontal= =0A space (crucial for netbooks).
=0A
Unity still keeps= application indicators in the same area as=0A system indicators, wh= ile GNOME Shell has system indicators only=0A on the top panel, redu= cing application "indicators" to=0A notification/status icons in the= notification tray (accessed by=0A moving your mouse to the bottom r= ight corner of the screen).=0A GNOME Shell is much more organized, s= o I prefer its style again.
=0A
Unity uses NotifyOSD for its n= otifications, while GNOME Shell=0A has its own notification system. = GNOME Shell's notifications are=0A small vertically and expand when = you move your mouse over them;=0A you can see past notifications by = looking in the notification=0A tray. NotifyOSD has semi-transparent = notifications in the=0A top-right corner that blur when you move you= r mouse over them.=0A They are un-clickable and provide no functiona= lity over Shell's=0A notifications; you can't even access a log of y= our past=0A notifications.
=0A
GNOME Shell features an = interface switcher that makes it easy=0A to spatially organize your = running applications. Unity has no=0A workspace switcher, and instea= d focuses on the currently running=0A application window.
=0A =
GNOME Shell's top bar is organized as follows: Activities=0A = button, Application menu, Clock (always in the center), Symbolic=0A = icons ("System indicators"), user menu. Unity's bar is as=0A follows= (this is subject to change, so I'm leaving out what I'm=0A not sure= will be there): Ubuntu button/logo, Indicators, Time,=0A MeMenu, Po= wer Menu. GNOME Shell has an advantage here because=0A the clock is = always in the center, while for Unity it is=0A awkwardly placed in-b= etween other panel items.
=0A
GNOME Shell is easily theme-able= , while Unity has not=0A announced any information on theme-ing as f= ar as I know.
=0A
=0A I hate to sound like I'm bashing Unity= , but GNOME Shell (at the very=0A moment, at least) seems like a much be= tter choice for both desktops=0A as well as netbooks and small-screen de= vices. Shell is also=0A developed by more organizations and companies th= an Unity and is more=0A "upstream".
=0A
=0A &nb= sp; - Ryan Peters
=0A
=0A PS: Just thought I should say that I= am in no way affiliated with=0A the GNOME Shell development or design t= eam, and I can't speak for=0A them. My emails are my own observations an= d opinions from what I=0A know so far and should not be taken as the opi= nions and observations=0A of anybody officially involved with the projec= ts I mention.
=0A

=0A

=0A=0A=0A=0A --0-1454109906-1280699522=:2145-- From allan.registos@smpc.steniel.com.ph Sun Aug 1 23:15:48 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB5F2750127 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 23:15:48 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.106 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.106 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RDNS_NONE=0.793] autolearn=no Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tdmUnuZaIBLG for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 23:15:45 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smpc.steniel.com.ph (unknown [203.131.100.54]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03950750172 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 23:15:36 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by smpc.steniel.com.ph (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13D2B2381EEE; Mon, 2 Aug 2010 07:15:29 +0800 (PHT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at smpc.steniel.com.ph Received: from smpc.steniel.com.ph ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smpc.steniel.com.ph [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rlfEGWmRe8n2; Mon, 2 Aug 2010 07:15:23 +0800 (PHT) Received: from smpc.steniel.com.ph (smpc.steniel.com.ph [203.131.100.54]) by smpc.steniel.com.ph (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DD322381E61; Mon, 2 Aug 2010 07:15:23 +0800 (PHT) Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2010 07:15:22 +0800 (PHT) From: "Allan E. Registos" To: "Grizzly(Francis Smit)" Message-ID: <963055072.78991280704522835.JavaMail.root@smpc.steniel.com.ph> In-Reply-To: <258755527.78971280704380072.JavaMail.root@smpc.steniel.com.ph> Subject: Re: some thoughts on gnome shell MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_5609_1407862074.1280704522833" X-Originating-IP: [203.131.100.52] X-Mailer: Zimbra 6.0.1_GA_1816.RHEL5_64 (ZimbraWebClient - SAF3 (Win)/6.0.1_GA_1816.RHEL5_64) Cc: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2010 23:15:49 -0000 ------=_Part_5609_1407862074.1280704522833 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I agree with the Mac OSX dock, which is hard to navigate of which icons, since you can't really recognize an image of your icon unless it is "Firefox" or "Thunderbird" of which we are so familiar with their associated icons. This same issue I can also found with gnome-shell with the APPLICATION feature where we can find tons of icons, it is hard to navigate even if it is Firefox when the icons are too many. The last time I check the gnome-shell with jbuild, the search feature doesn't work out of the box except for some applications. Yes, I am hoping that the critical issues will be resolve before releasing it to the public(I heard delays, but that is to be expected) to avoid repeating the problem we have with KDE 4.0. The Application mockup looks great. But honestly, this mockup only reduces the problem of "hard to navigate" to "less hard to navigate" with the addition of app categories. And it is easier for most users since they don't really have tons of icons of each app category. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Grizzly(Francis Smit)" To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Sent: Sunday, August 1, 2010 1:08:22 AM Subject: Re: some thoughts on gnome shell On 01/08/10 01:26, Ryan Peters wrote: > Hello Francis, > > On 07/31/2010 12:50 AM, Grizzly(Francis Smit) wrote: >> 1). the menus are a pain if you don't know the name of what ur >> looking for, u cannot browse > I'm pretty sure this is the case for every operating system once you > first use it. Exactly which menu are you talking about? Applications > menu, clock preferences menu, user menu...? Note that GNOME Shell will > look much different > > in the future, and the menus you find hard to navigate (in this > example, the applications menu) will be much easier to navigate. ok that looks much better how soon will I be able to play with this :-P >> 2). and theres no where to put my short cut links, in normal gnome I >> have 4 panels top bottom and each side top and sides have lots of >> quick launch launchers i.e. icons and some applets, I love applets >> bottom is my taskbar I love that two I hate the taskbar > The application switcher lets you have "favorite" applications. This > is much more space-saving than quick-launch links because it only pops > up when you need it to and it gives you much more vertical screen > space. If you require launchers like that, try launching something > like DockbarX in standalone mode, using Docky/AWN/Cairo Dock, or some > other solution that can run independently of the panel. >> which brings me to >> 3). no taskbar I need my taskbar switching apps in gnome-shell sux > The Application switcher is actually much more efficient than a > standard panel-based application switcher. Applications are grouped > and it's easy to find specific windows if you have many open. As I > said earlier, independent "dock-style" programs could help your > apparent need for an always-visible application switcher. ok I'll try some of those again, but I'm turned off when people describe these things as being like Mac OS X as I find that system repulsive, as far as I'm concerned OS X is the ugliest desktop I have ever seen -- In my life God comes first.... but Linux is pretty high after that :-D Grizzly(Francis Smit) http://www.google.com/profiles/grizzlysmit _______________________________________________ gnome-shell-list mailing list gnome-shell-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list ------=_Part_5609_1407862074.1280704522833 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <= div style=3D'font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 12pt; color: #000000'= >I agree with the Mac OSX dock, which is hard to navigate of which icons, s= ince you can't really recognize an image of your icon unless it is "Firefox= " or "Thunderbird" of which we are so familiar with their associated icons.=

This same issue I can also found with gnome-shell with the APPLICATION= feature where we can find tons of icons, it is hard to navigate even if it= is Firefox when the icons are too many. The last time I check the gnome-sh= ell with jbuild, the search feature doesn't work out of the box except for = some applications. Yes, I am hoping that the critical issues will be resolv= e before releasing it to the public(I heard delays, but that is to be = expected) to avoid repeating the problem we have with KDE 4.0. The Application mockup looks great. But hones= tly, this mockup only reduces the problem of "hard to navigate" to "less ha= rd to navigate" with the addition of app categories. And it is easier for m= ost users since they don't really have tons of icons of each app category.<= /div>

----- Original Message -----
From: "Grizzly= (Francis Smit)" <grizzly@smit.id.au>
To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.or= g
Sent: Sunday, August 1, 2010 1:08:22 AM
Subject: Re: some thoughts = on gnome shell

On 01/08/10 01:26, Ryan Peters wrote:
> Hello F= rancis,
>
> On 07/31/2010 12:50 AM, Grizzly(Francis Smit) wrote= :
>> 1). the menus are a pain if you don't know the name of what u= r
>> looking for, u cannot browse
> I'm pretty sure this is= the case for every operating system once you
> first use it. Exactl= y which menu are you talking about? Applications
> menu, clock prefe= rences menu, user menu...? Note that GNOME Shell will
> look much di= fferent
> <http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-shell-design/plain/m= ockups/static/overview-application-picker.png>
> in the future, a= nd the menus you find hard to navigate (in this
> example, the appli= cations menu) will be much easier to navigate.
ok that looks much better= how soon will I be able to play with this :-P
>> 2). and theres n= o where to put my short cut links, in normal gnome I
>> have 4 pa= nels top bottom and each side top and sides have lots of
>> quick= launch launchers i.e. icons and some applets, I love applets
>> = bottom is my taskbar I love that two I hate the taskbar
> The applica= tion switcher lets you have "favorite" applications. This
> is much = more space-saving than quick-launch links because it only pops
> up = when you need it to and it gives you much more vertical screen
> spa= ce. If you require launchers like that, try launching something
> li= ke DockbarX in standalone mode, using Docky/AWN/Cairo Dock, or some
>= ; other solution that can run independently of the panel.
>> which= brings me to
>> 3). no taskbar I need my taskbar switching apps i= n gnome-shell sux
> The Application switcher is actually much more ef= ficient than a
> standard panel-based application switcher. Applicat= ions are grouped
> and it's easy to find specific windows if you hav= e many open. As I
> said earlier, independent "dock-style" programs = could help your
> apparent need for an always-visible application sw= itcher.
ok I'll try some of those again, but I'm turned off when people = describe
these things as being like Mac OS X as I find that system repu= lsive, as
far as I'm concerned OS X is the ugliest desktop I have ever = seen

--
In my life God comes first.... but Linu= x is pretty high after that :-D
Grizzly(Francis Smit)
http://www.goog= le.com/profiles/grizzlysmit

________________________________________= _______
gnome-shell-list mailing list
gnome-shell-list@gnome.org
h= ttp://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list

------=_Part_5609_1407862074.1280704522833-- From florian.muellner@gmail.com Sun Aug 1 23:49:20 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65B337500B8 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 23:49:20 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.89 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.89 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_TO_NO_BRKTS_FREEMAIL=0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2Cq0V606V0gX for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 23:49:17 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ew0-f54.google.com (mail-ew0-f54.google.com [209.85.215.54]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E0C1750079 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2010 23:49:08 +0000 (UTC) Received: by ewy26 with SMTP id 26so1561826ewy.27 for ; Sun, 01 Aug 2010 16:49:07 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:sender:subject:from:to :in-reply-to:references:content-type:date:message-id:mime-version :x-mailer:content-transfer-encoding; bh=jFHRDiZtkkdtuAuY/GuPIAN9fJyZ2nD6knkeXSHcAb0=; b=cjv4c7kZMj5lcBMhrcRt0JwhJsDUWZSVZemlcBdTBN3cqwIiAt/GGA3C5l+AD0HwYE qGbKLIzEvsYkrJ6pWHwt3nutdYGUBxMRiq9HICVR1ZSVk7hs+wNl/iqOSkjX9IIHLyLj l1jZ8CeGVcNW8LHxDrXGM8hv/onmn5VzCICj4= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=sender:subject:from:to:in-reply-to:references:content-type:date :message-id:mime-version:x-mailer:content-transfer-encoding; b=MViqdOiaTNFT3SGtAf7Lhmtwpuqb6XV2g+qL8Lh3cLWZFw4OdjobxWXbYM/uF8yIQx H2B0FIe1S7k5cODL00WE7ozAozwxxxSdeEQUcVccvdpp6SvhG4IvRV/XrNlxn9Tg4QDb oYc41AehOFq3u3ESg/A4ZZjPttdsTqhiFMf9U= Received: by 10.213.4.81 with SMTP id 17mr3129711ebq.97.1280706547173; Sun, 01 Aug 2010 16:49:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.220.108] (osbk-4db1492e.pool.mediaWays.net [77.177.73.46]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id u9sm1810593eeh.5.2010.08.01.16.49.05 (version=SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Sun, 01 Aug 2010 16:49:06 -0700 (PDT) Sender: Florian Max Subject: Re: some thoughts on gnome shell From: Florian =?ISO-8859-1?Q?M=FCllner?= To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org In-Reply-To: <713042.2145.qm@web24207.mail.ird.yahoo.com> References: <4C53B9BF.20104@smit.id.au> <4C5440B2.1060403@sbcglobal.net> <424762.34017.qm@web24208.mail.ird.yahoo.com> <4C54C8BC.3090800@sbcglobal.net> <713042.2145.qm@web24207.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2010 01:49:03 +0200 Message-ID: <1280706543.13227.350.camel@chiquitin.ratonera.local> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.30.2 (2.30.2-4.fc13) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2010 23:49:20 -0000 Hi, El dom, 01-08-2010 a las 21:52 +0000, Sean Dunwoody escribió: > Also, my first question didn't really get answered, is that really > what the shell team is working towards? Yes. There are still some "white spots" the designers are working on (e.g. how DND will work in detail, the future of grid view, ...), but the general direction is more or less clear. Work on the code has been started and should appear on bugzilla and/or a git branch soon. > I'm just a bit curious, and I can't see reason behind some of the > changes :-/ Then ask :-) Seriously, I can't promise you answers (I am not a designer), but good questions can be pretty valuable input for designers. Florian From sloshy45@sbcglobal.net Mon Aug 2 14:29:19 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AABE6750120 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2010 14:29:19 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.276 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.276 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=0.723, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001] autolearn=no Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UyGP+CWg9D1D for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2010 14:29:17 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp104.sbc.mail.ac4.yahoo.com (smtp104.sbc.mail.ac4.yahoo.com [76.13.13.243]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 7C8EB75027F for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2010 14:29:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 50978 invoked from network); 2 Aug 2010 14:29:07 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=sbcglobal.net; h=DKIM-Signature:Received:X-Yahoo-SMTP:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=f2F0hl0sJtYXsLxBBsdhvWevTLEIwPh9zBmf1JEx8T0pkGikc1clLPsARSHRy6e2mxEi9Rig5tDaRL3sbMGxIZZqSi5zT3ZjjlQrTwbySXQ4H1xaP9PqwwPqjqXDQoaeX0iKqEAD8uewWoM3VytZltC9GDR5U61ns+dHME82Azs= ; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=sbcglobal.net; s=s1024; t=1280759347; bh=tkMy53G/sMjx3ehoT+N80gtEaC2IE4S5/k9vF85MkZU=; h=Received:X-Yahoo-SMTP:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=PAkcWQ3zZSPMAIR1go36naqjgAURrNXOjiCKMHs+xx75poUVMUPoRCw5+dyMKMSMXFlV42O1R7EmQVQ6venZvnKK+Lsy+z3v6adle6Jh8VhL+xlh08qc9WKLETvpNlnEbRIXX+ETQh1th2lC5/CpTlK++thZvY6uyh6csV/+JeY= Received: from [192.168.1.118] (sloshy45@99.140.202.33 with plain) by smtp104.sbc.mail.ac4.yahoo.com with SMTP; 02 Aug 2010 07:29:06 -0700 PDT X-Yahoo-SMTP: OhstvuiswBBz7FeX8HKAFDd.RuNJU6P8idCqCh6OCFkheW0- X-YMail-OSG: CAfBifQVM1m.6kdiiMZvpurui54KvZ5s.tGLkG0fSpNEXJB 9NKMR6JhPdjcQJmzGhgUwMJ77.bTNr0jfzFNaMtSm4beuBl21jKEzZ5vV9z0 NBC1MRB1J4PKtW3.U2d6sdGPGAiAFG2hYkr6IT68PRDzm5OmBNy6DuYV.Qef OmXN0PLG1FYH_O1Z2dBblS4BJaIKGSjpJBjMF5joZEciUDFa.w8eZWU3yQx2 Tt5s_WgAUeJGdUCg4kTt9lTmRLq.yziPxmeiVKf0zrsWU0KZOcDpjcpMjd6z 2taPF X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Message-ID: <4C56D631.2020301@sbcglobal.net> Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2010 09:29:05 -0500 From: Ryan Peters User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.9.2.7) Gecko/20100720 Lanikai/3.1.1 ThunderBrowse/3.3.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Sean Dunwoody , gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Subject: Re: some thoughts on gnome shell References: <4C53B9BF.20104@smit.id.au> <4C5440B2.1060403@sbcglobal.net> <424762.34017.qm@web24208.mail.ird.yahoo.com> <4C54C8BC.3090800@sbcglobal.net> <713042.2145.qm@web24207.mail.ird.yahoo.com> <4C55F610.3070706@sbcglobal.net> <621719.93337.qm@web24205.mail.ird.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <621719.93337.qm@web24205.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2010 14:29:20 -0000 On 08/02/2010 09:03 AM, Sean Dunwoody wrote:

Thanks,

I really should have checked the design documents before but I can't seem to access them now, it seems that the gnome project website is down :-/

Also your design breakdown was really good, I agree with you that the new Shell has advantages to Unity, but it still looks like the Gnome team took A LOT of influence from the canonical team. The message tray is awesome and original though, much better than NotifyOSD :-)

-Sean

I agree they took a lot of influence, but just in the same kind of way that OpenOffice.org would take influence from MS Office, or Firefox taking influence from Chrome or Opera. In a world of ideas that you can't lock down, it's relatively easy and effective to take an idea that somebody else already thought of, think about it, and apply it (especially if the idea is a good one). Once again, while Shell does look similar to Unity, they function very, very differently with different purposes in mind. Instead of re-inventing the wheel, Unity is polishing it, while Shell is putting snow-spikes on it ;).

I've put up a temporary mirror of the design document on my Dropbox account for you. http://dl.dropbox.com/u/807039/GNOME_Shell-20091114.pdf

Enjoy!
- Ryan Peters
From mnovenstern@students.colgate.edu Thu Aug 5 11:47:37 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60370750382; Thu, 5 Aug 2010 11:47:37 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id K7vhSV0cP-+S; Thu, 5 Aug 2010 11:47:31 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ey0-f182.google.com (mail-ey0-f182.google.com [209.85.215.182]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF88175037A; Thu, 5 Aug 2010 11:47:22 +0000 (UTC) Received: by eyh6 with SMTP id 6so3105300eyh.27 for ; Thu, 05 Aug 2010 04:47:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.14.45.8 with SMTP id o8mr4171949eeb.57.1281008840312; Thu, 05 Aug 2010 04:47:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.2.135] (86-41-209-153-dynamic.b-ras1.lmk.limerick.eircom.net [86.41.209.153]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id v8sm136002eeh.2.2010.08.05.04.47.18 (version=SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Thu, 05 Aug 2010 04:47:19 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Gnome Shell Message Tray Week 10 From: Matt Novenstern To: gnome-soc-list , gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-Ac/zQjifaHdu6nWw5hOG" Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2010 12:34:04 +0200 Message-ID: <1280745244.3917.112.camel@clam> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.30.2 X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2010 11:47:37 -0000 --=-Ac/zQjifaHdu6nWw5hOG Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hopefully this will reach the lists before it's too horribly late. I'm somewhere in Britain on a train that has more people on it than seats and the conductor won't let the train go until nobody's standing in the isle... This past week I got to experience GUADEC! It was really quite neat to meet the gnome shell devs in person and get to talk to them a little. It was really fun learning how people got into FOSS and working on gnome, and what other things they'd done in the past. I also go to meet a bunch of my fellow SoC students, and see a little of what they're working on in person. Despite the excitement, I managed to post a new patch for splitting the status icons up, even though that still behaves nastily due to the hacks we use with the embedded windows and the doesn't-play-well-with-others nature of the windows in the first place. I'm hoping to dive into the design concept frenzy and start making some things based on mockups of stuff for the tray. We'll see what's gobject introspectable and what I might need to work on. -Matt --=-Ac/zQjifaHdu6nWw5hOG Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAkxWnxkACgkQcxL8f4Q9JT+VlQCeNkao91L6HHBjWvWqa95RXewt Z4QAniR+/3bFl+3bxrho5F0H6p/4/ImZ =cypH -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-Ac/zQjifaHdu6nWw5hOG-- From sloshy45@sbcglobal.net Thu Aug 5 22:57:43 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD39A75009D for ; Thu, 5 Aug 2010 22:57:42 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.276 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.276 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=0.723, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001] autolearn=no Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id KXjCgR-p2KmX for ; Thu, 5 Aug 2010 22:57:41 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp108.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com (smtp108.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com [68.142.198.106]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with SMTP id B2B6375006B for ; Thu, 5 Aug 2010 22:57:32 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 27502 invoked from network); 5 Aug 2010 22:57:30 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=sbcglobal.net; h=DKIM-Signature:Received:X-Yahoo-SMTP:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=O7RZsyz4xnZA8LyRmrild31u3pn5GqQ8igB4ufm+dwYhERfze3o0tKWOcmJ2PEQKXt3tMn/vsNcY3R2QtZ/LANCSUbV3qcPU/0v6lD0FR7czGuFfhbGj8ycGWt8i9dNKCjvO9iv9cT13bM1hv7S2ysGHW0eZiSlNY84cGM4x9uM= ; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=sbcglobal.net; s=s1024; t=1281049050; bh=TY1AVmqKXcwm4YO+/jB0DNQPtwqIsqtyqepvkK2K04c=; h=Received:X-Yahoo-SMTP:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=knPRlMBKe5MNVJ5lLZs58zO7kq/FPg1OUBik/buQIm+xCzD6xzqwDlp0hxMn+WorDfoJo45ISreLMrZUiADXX8BzKb00DKwTHS5N3Y5OXzlORcTqFaIw8LUA7la5UOAS3CkWzVrr/yPHBHJi0jG7eSNstQPjE/jTQUm+EQTN8pI= Received: from [192.168.1.118] (sloshy45@76.197.177.208 with plain) by smtp108.sbc.mail.mud.yahoo.com with SMTP; 05 Aug 2010 15:57:30 -0700 PDT X-Yahoo-SMTP: OhstvuiswBBz7FeX8HKAFDd.RuNJU6P8idCqCh6OCFkheW0- X-YMail-OSG: .BZqFTEVM1n94PgIQYvoMt0CgUqqdzVwVbBCVLeF2Mo_6oz _BIzGaDBy9wFFAWwoUJkVL_e0ASvyGEZNLK.nFfZZiBL1an6dBUvsQO8AcdH zJWLvhCDhyleBAJM.i_BJP8.pUi94PKUlgJmhVkSt9iCcVROO3hKKuTcDZ08 d_3J2Ahrt7bWUFhTscrtvwL2_UIRJ3G02zrV8kd3RoyLngaZsinhvs0gjRg3 SJjLQWClY0JFK.7kzIF1bpuPa0h7OyGSSqqjSwGuJGsG02Dc.vkX72L_ptfa wxwE- X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Message-ID: <4C5B41D8.8050900@sbcglobal.net> Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2010 17:57:28 -0500 From: Ryan Peters User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.9.2.8) Gecko/20100806 Lanikai/3.1.2 ThunderBrowse/3.3.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Matt Novenstern , gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Subject: Re: Gnome Shell Message Tray Week 10 References: <1280745244.3917.112.camel@clam> In-Reply-To: <1280745244.3917.112.camel@clam> Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2010 22:57:43 -0000 On 08/02/2010 05:34 AM, Matt Novenstern wrote:

Hopefully this will reach the lists before it's too horribly late.  I'm
somewhere in Britain on a train that has more people on it than seats
and the conductor won't let the train go until nobody's standing in the
isle...

This past week I got to experience GUADEC!  It was really quite neat to
meet the gnome shell devs in person and get to talk to them a little.
It was really fun learning how people got into FOSS and working on
gnome, and what other things they'd done in the past.  I also go to meet
a bunch of my fellow SoC students, and see a little of what they're
working on in person.

Despite the excitement, I managed to post a new patch for splitting the
status icons up, even though that still behaves nastily due to the hacks
we use with the embedded windows and the doesn't-play-well-with-others
nature of the windows in the first place.

I'm hoping to dive into the design concept frenzy and start making some
things based on mockups of stuff for the tray.  We'll see what's gobject
introspectable and what I might need to work on.

-Matt


_______________________________________________
gnome-shell-list mailing list
gnome-shell-list@gnome.org
http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list

Sounds fun and great! I thought I'd just say thank you for your work (so you feel a little more important) and I hope it goes well! I'm looking forward to your improvements, and God bless!

- Ryan Peters, Shell tester
From sbrady@gtfservices.com Sun Aug 8 22:03:41 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AB8D75008A for ; Sun, 8 Aug 2010 22:03:41 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id aYX-jxNg2VIi for ; Sun, 8 Aug 2010 22:03:39 +0000 (UTC) Received: from EXHUB017-2.exch017.msoutlookonline.net (exhub017-2.exch017.msoutlookonline.net [64.78.22.17]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56ECF750077 for ; Sun, 8 Aug 2010 22:03:30 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [192.168.2.236] (24.8.50.199) by smtpx17.msoutlookonline.net (64.78.22.37) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.2.234.1; Sun, 8 Aug 2010 15:03:29 -0700 Message-ID: <4C5F29B0.2050905@gtfservices.com> Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2010 16:03:28 -0600 From: Sean Brady Organization: GTF Services LLC User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux x86_64; en-US; rv:1.9.2.7) Gecko/20100720 Fedora/3.1.1-1.fc13 Lightning/1.0b2pre Thunderbird/3.1.1 ThunderBrowse/3.3.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Shell-List Subject: Suggestion: File paths in overlay search, apps in order of last use Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list Reply-To: sbrady@gtfservices.com List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2010 22:03:41 -0000 I was just thinking the other day that the addition of these two simple tweaks that would add some usability to Gnome-Shell: 1. Allow us to open file paths in nautilus/file browser when entered in the search. (this would be awesome) Better yet, show all the files in that directory (in overlay mode) and allow us to open the directory in the file browser in overlay. As an example, if the user types /usr/bin, the overlay's search will show us a window while still in overlay mode with all the files, much like the "application picker" window (clicking on the arrow to the right of "Applications"). You would have an interface option that will allow you to open the directory, or you can single-click a file (object) to open it. 2. Show applications in overlay in order of last use. I think that this is the "kill" for the lack of a window list issue. The more I use it, the more I realize that this is more effective anyway, and if the application icons were grouped by last use (as in, the last application from which focus was switched). It would be perfect for those that need to switch between applications repeatedly. And by the way, the more I use GS, the more I am in the anti-window list camp. Thanks folks. Sean On a side note, I had to revert back to using GNOME 2.x's interface for a second the other day for something unrelated to GS, and I realized how much I really did not enjoy the experience. I have been using Gnome-Shell exclusively on my personal laptop since April, and even in it's infancy it's superior to anything else that I have tried. Thanks to the devs for your hard work. From sloshy45@sbcglobal.net Mon Aug 9 00:14:39 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0401D7500C4 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2010 00:14:39 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Y6q22aDcW-E7 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2010 00:14:35 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp104.sbc.mail.ac4.yahoo.com (smtp104.sbc.mail.ac4.yahoo.com [76.13.13.243]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 5007D7500BF for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2010 00:14:26 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 25272 invoked from network); 9 Aug 2010 00:14:25 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=sbcglobal.net; h=DKIM-Signature:Received:X-Yahoo-SMTP:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=J9ZsH9bia7lNY3p9otT54vf9w3ze72EdujXmBvqblEJTND3X33OaKewBdLUYAuceerO8cGrAnN4IsuuIAy9Y9mRRwPoaPPubv0rU92PpPi339VZycL50eFi0yAHThtAT7CcNu7ylC2nVkZ94lSeCQ5xC+pzkeSjSzdtqfKroICU= ; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=sbcglobal.net; s=s1024; t=1281312865; bh=3t8kw5ffONCwYnRfTnLNvrgIadfpnFNC3bLWXuF2qjE=; h=Received:X-Yahoo-SMTP:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=5S+FDazoo5Hx6cjoF4SIDUYjdtp1PltZDjc8OpPeNQ5Y1MERqTJAtX5mEcYVhZMMu3t5WX6ITGmx2tSBTt0Y2mCyQ7L7UOkEmZ3SIqkBra78JtaMTxh9S0sQXd7nKdHGNbDOdak6RtUoM8yF2EPU3Y+NpH5Fkyl16NNBu/W1wa8= Received: from [192.168.1.118] (sloshy45@76.197.177.208 with plain) by smtp104.sbc.mail.ac4.yahoo.com with SMTP; 08 Aug 2010 17:14:25 -0700 PDT X-Yahoo-SMTP: OhstvuiswBBz7FeX8HKAFDd.RuNJU6P8idCqCh6OCFkheW0- X-YMail-OSG: BJ_5DDQVM1lwu8bLosu.5GEo.phVZRC3LzaVP8lUjR8Ye63 rfLjNaX4NFu0ly46kWvUOdOxEnR.laUoJ0ALPmWqXmAsc1D7on4L3nqSalAO RQaxQk4Ay.OzXzreIFksiks6zL4DbvprPHidkdUgXuqF1WS.svW8Egx4J5B2 .NrFP11uYJkGeZgzfI06tfL2ZCGGbvmHQKnmPdMXBp_hGcsYo4egqkYP2Ys0 bqHmLIgcYMeJfNuXksERMBN0LEUTf.pv3VxCYyVPYBPfO7xtgmytohCqO2ea khQ-- X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Message-ID: <4C5F483A.90001@sbcglobal.net> Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2010 19:13:46 -0500 From: Ryan Peters User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.9.2.8) Gecko/20100806 Lanikai/3.1.2 ThunderBrowse/3.3.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Subject: Re: Suggestion: File paths in overlay search, apps in order of last use References: <4C5F29B0.2050905@gtfservices.com> In-Reply-To: <4C5F29B0.2050905@gtfservices.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2010 00:14:39 -0000 Hello Sean, On 08/08/2010 05:03 PM, Sean Brady wrote: > I was just thinking the other day that the addition of these two > simple tweaks that would add some usability to Gnome-Shell: > > 1. Allow us to open file paths in nautilus/file browser when entered > in the search. (this would be awesome) Better yet, show all the files > in that directory (in overlay mode) and allow us to open the directory > in the file browser in overlay. As an example, if the user types > /usr/bin, the overlay's search will show us a window while still in > overlay mode with all the files, much like the "application picker" > window (clicking on the arrow to the right of "Applications"). You > would have an interface option that will allow you to open the > directory, or you can single-click a file (object) to open it. I agree. This would be a very useful function; maybe a plugin or extension of some sort could be made? > 2. Show applications in overlay in order of last use. I think that > this is the "kill" for the lack of a window list issue. The more I > use it, the more I realize that this is more effective anyway, and if > the application icons were grouped by last use (as in, the last > application from which focus was switched). It would be perfect for > those that need to switch between applications repeatedly. And by the > way, the more I use GS, the more I am in the anti-window list camp. I'm not so sure on this one. It could be enabled with an extension of some sort, but the "application well" has a function for favorite applications. These favorites are user-organized, and moving them around based on use would cause confusion because users would find that their applications are in a seemingly random order every time. However, Alt+Tab groups applications by when they were last switched to, I believe, so you could always use that instead. > Thanks folks. > Sean > > > On a side note, I had to revert back to using GNOME 2.x's interface > for a second the other day for something unrelated to GS, and I > realized how much I really did not enjoy the experience. I have been > using Gnome-Shell exclusively on my personal laptop since April, and > even in it's infancy it's superior to anything else that I have > tried. Thanks to the devs for your hard work. > _______________________________________________ > gnome-shell-list mailing list > gnome-shell-list@gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list > From sbrady@gtfservices.com Mon Aug 9 04:09:55 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2AA52750122 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2010 04:09:55 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id MVUvZl65j5L9 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2010 04:09:50 +0000 (UTC) Received: from EXHUB017-4.exch017.msoutlookonline.net (exhub017-4.exch017.msoutlookonline.net [64.78.22.19]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0CE4A750129 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2010 04:09:41 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [192.168.2.236] (24.8.50.199) by smtpx17.msoutlookonline.net (64.78.22.39) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.2.234.1; Sun, 8 Aug 2010 21:09:40 -0700 Message-ID: <4C5F7F83.2050007@gtfservices.com> Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2010 22:09:39 -0600 From: Sean Brady Organization: GTF Services LLC User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux x86_64; en-US; rv:1.9.2.7) Gecko/20100720 Fedora/3.1.1-1.fc13 Lightning/1.0b2pre Thunderbird/3.1.1 ThunderBrowse/3.3.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Subject: Re: Suggestion: File paths in overlay search, apps in order of last use References: <4C5F29B0.2050905@gtfservices.com> <4C5F483A.90001@sbcglobal.net> In-Reply-To: <4C5F483A.90001@sbcglobal.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list Reply-To: sbrady@gtfservices.com List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2010 04:09:55 -0000 Now that you mention it, moving the favorites around would be a pain. Scratch that thought. I'm using the daily jhbuild, which has broken the favorites so many times I suppose I stopped setting them, so I guess I forgot about them. :) I really really like the file path idea though, especially if it had tabular completion. And the possibilities for plugins is endless. On 08/08/2010 06:13 PM, Ryan Peters wrote: > Hello Sean, > > On 08/08/2010 05:03 PM, Sean Brady wrote: >> I was just thinking the other day that the addition of these two >> simple tweaks that would add some usability to Gnome-Shell: >> >> 1. Allow us to open file paths in nautilus/file browser when entered >> in the search. (this would be awesome) Better yet, show all the files >> in that directory (in overlay mode) and allow us to open the directory >> in the file browser in overlay. As an example, if the user types >> /usr/bin, the overlay's search will show us a window while still in >> overlay mode with all the files, much like the "application picker" >> window (clicking on the arrow to the right of "Applications"). You >> would have an interface option that will allow you to open the >> directory, or you can single-click a file (object) to open it. > I agree. This would be a very useful function; maybe a plugin or > extension of some sort could be made? >> 2. Show applications in overlay in order of last use. I think that >> this is the "kill" for the lack of a window list issue. The more I >> use it, the more I realize that this is more effective anyway, and if >> the application icons were grouped by last use (as in, the last >> application from which focus was switched). It would be perfect for >> those that need to switch between applications repeatedly. And by the >> way, the more I use GS, the more I am in the anti-window list camp. > I'm not so sure on this one. It could be enabled with an extension of > some sort, but the "application well" has a function for favorite > applications. These favorites are user-organized, and moving them around > based on use would cause confusion because users would find that their > applications are in a seemingly random order every time. However, > Alt+Tab groups applications by when they were last switched to, I > believe, so you could always use that instead. >> Thanks folks. >> Sean >> >> >> On a side note, I had to revert back to using GNOME 2.x's interface >> for a second the other day for something unrelated to GS, and I >> realized how much I really did not enjoy the experience. I have been >> using Gnome-Shell exclusively on my personal laptop since April, and >> even in it's infancy it's superior to anything else that I have >> tried. Thanks to the devs for your hard work. >> _______________________________________________ >> gnome-shell-list mailing list >> gnome-shell-list@gnome.org >> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list >> > _______________________________________________ > gnome-shell-list mailing list > gnome-shell-list@gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-shell-list From mnovenstern@students.colgate.edu Mon Aug 9 15:14:30 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 820A5750192; Mon, 9 Aug 2010 15:14:30 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Md9pNMTwVLFL; Mon, 9 Aug 2010 15:14:27 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-qy0-f175.google.com (mail-qy0-f175.google.com [209.85.216.175]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69F0E750138; Mon, 9 Aug 2010 15:14:16 +0000 (UTC) Received: by qyk11 with SMTP id 11so2312483qyk.6 for ; Mon, 09 Aug 2010 08:14:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.229.186.4 with SMTP id cq4mr5171503qcb.0.1281366854100; Mon, 09 Aug 2010 08:14:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.3] (ool-45767b73.dyn.optonline.net [69.118.123.115]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id f15sm1464589qcr.25.2010.08.09.08.14.13 (version=SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Mon, 09 Aug 2010 08:14:13 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Message Tray Report Week 11 From: Matt Novenstern To: gnome-soc-list , gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2010 11:14:12 -0400 Message-ID: <1281366852.18939.200.camel@clam> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.30.2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2010 15:14:30 -0000 Like William, I was traveling for the week after GUADEC and so I haven't really had the time or reliable internet access required to get much done. I've been looking at documentation for things like weather and appointments, but unfortunately it doesn't seem like libgweather or libedataserver have typelib bindings (in debian at least) yet. I also have a lot of mail to catch up on... -Matt From apinheiro@igalia.com Thu Aug 12 17:56:52 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07BEF75022D for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2010 17:56:52 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.511 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_RP_RNBL=1.31, SPF_NEUTRAL=0.779] autolearn=no Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LzETqdrj+IJR for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2010 17:56:49 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp4.mundo-r.com (smtp4.mundo-r.com [212.51.32.151]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1EF1750103 for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2010 17:56:40 +0000 (UTC) X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AtAEAJjSY0xbdWOb/2dsb2JhbACTMI13vjOFOgSJXg X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.55,359,1278280800"; d="scan'208";a="751325449" Received: from 155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com (HELO fanzine.igalia.com) ([91.117.99.155]) by smtp4.mundo-r.com with ESMTP; 12 Aug 2010 19:56:38 +0200 Received: from maestria.local.igalia.com ([192.168.10.14] helo=mail.igalia.com) by fanzine.igalia.com with esmtps (Cipher TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim) id 1Ojc18-0003Xq-8h for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2010 19:56:38 +0200 Received: from ip154.dynamic.igalia.com ([192.168.10.154] helo=remigio) by mail.igalia.com with esmtps (Cipher TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim) id 1Ojc18-0005lJ-3m for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2010 19:56:38 +0200 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by remigio with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Ojc18-0002m0-9a for gnome-shell-list@gnome.org; Thu, 12 Aug 2010 19:56:38 +0200 Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2010 19:56:38 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <20100812.195638.88382342.apinheiro@igalia.com> To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Subject: Some issues calling atk methods From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Pi=F1eiro?= X-Mailer: Mew version 6.3 on Emacs 23.1 / Mule 6.0 (HANACHIRUSATO) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2010 17:56:52 -0000 (Not sure if this is the proper list, but detected using gnome-shell, sorry for the noise if this is the case). These days I was experimenting with atk on javascript. I was able to import it without problem, and execute the methods and so on, so all seems to work fine. But then, I tried to call the method atk_object_get_name [1]. Using looking glass, I get something like that: >>> r(0) = [0xXXXXXX StLabel ("Activities")] >>> label = r (0) r(1) = [0xXXXXXX StLabel ("Activities")] >>> atk_label = label.get_accessible () r(2) = [object instance proxy GIName:Atk.GObjectAccessible jsobj@0xXXXXXXX native@0xXXXXXX] >>> atk_label.get_name () r(3) = >>> atk_label.get_name (0) r(4) = press After thinking a little about it, I realize that this .get_name that is being called is atk_action_get_name [2], as this class implements AtkAction interface. So I suppose that when the prototype is created, the AtkObject.get_name is overriden by AtkAction.get_name. This would also means that if this object starts to implementing other interface with a .get_name (atk_whatever_get_name), atk_label.get_name could be this one (without a written policy to know what one, probably the last used on the definition time). Although I tried some (random) ways to call atk_object_get_name on this object, I was not able to do that. Any idea or hint? Thanks for your attention. [1] http://library.gnome.org/devel/atk/stable/AtkObject.html#atk-object-get-name [2] http://library.gnome.org/devel/atk/stable/AtkAction.html#atk-action-get-name === API (apinheiro@igalia.com) From danw@gnome.org Fri Aug 13 15:30:00 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67E8F750721 for ; Fri, 13 Aug 2010 15:30:00 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.823 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.823 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, TW_GJ=0.077] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id A+94osfmSR6e for ; Fri, 13 Aug 2010 15:29:55 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mysterion.org (mysterion.org [69.25.196.35]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED39F75069B for ; Fri, 13 Aug 2010 15:29:46 +0000 (UTC) Received: from desktop.home.mysterion.org (c-76-97-71-164.hsd1.ga.comcast.net [76.97.71.164]) by mysterion.org (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 61E23802AE; Fri, 13 Aug 2010 11:29:44 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4C6564E7.3080307@gnome.org> Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2010 11:29:43 -0400 From: Dan Winship User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux x86_64; en-US; rv:1.9.2.7) Gecko/20100720 Fedora/3.1.1-1.fc13 Thunderbird/3.1.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Pi=F1eiro?= Subject: Re: Some issues calling atk methods References: <20100812.195638.88382342.apinheiro@igalia.com> In-Reply-To: <20100812.195638.88382342.apinheiro@igalia.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2010 15:30:00 -0000 On 08/12/2010 01:56 PM, Pi�eiro wrote: > After thinking a little about it, I realize that this .get_name that > is being called is atk_action_get_name [2], as this class implements > AtkAction interface. > Although I tried some (random) ways to call atk_object_get_name on > this object, I was not able to do that. > > Any idea or hint? hm... try Atk.Object.prototype.get_name.call(atk_label) ? That assumes AtkLabel isn't overriding AtkObjectClass->get_name... if it is, I don't think there's any way in gjs to refer to AtkLabel's implementation of the method. Does this work usefully in other language bindings? I think this is just considered bad class design, and the answer is "don't do that then"... -- Dan From apinheiro@igalia.com Fri Aug 13 17:04:58 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A07827505BA; Fri, 13 Aug 2010 17:04:58 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.744 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.744 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_NEUTRAL=0.779, TW_GJ=0.077] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jGqafo+td7cA; Fri, 13 Aug 2010 17:04:53 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp4.mundo-r.com (smtp4.mundo-r.com [212.51.32.151]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9ECBB750566; Fri, 13 Aug 2010 17:04:43 +0000 (UTC) X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: ApsEAN4XZUxbdWOb/2dsb2JhbAChKsAFgwMIgi8EiV8 X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.55,364,1278280800"; d="scan'208";a="669102802" Received: from 155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com (HELO fanzine.igalia.com) ([91.117.99.155]) by smtp4.mundo-r.com with ESMTP; 13 Aug 2010 19:04:42 +0200 Received: from [192.168.12.188] (helo=remigio) by fanzine.igalia.com with esmtpsa (Cipher TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim) id 1OjxgQ-0000KP-2N; Fri, 13 Aug 2010 19:04:42 +0200 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=localhost) by remigio with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1OjxgQ-0006lc-4U; Fri, 13 Aug 2010 19:04:42 +0200 Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2010 19:04:42 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <20100813.190442.200288960.apinheiro@igalia.com> To: danw@gnome.org Subject: Re: Some issues calling atk methods From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Pi=F1eiro?= In-Reply-To: <4C6564E7.3080307@gnome.org> References: <20100812.195638.88382342.apinheiro@igalia.com> <4C6564E7.3080307@gnome.org> X-Mailer: Mew version 6.3 on Emacs 23.1 / Mule 6.0 (HANACHIRUSATO) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cc: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2010 17:04:59 -0000 From: Dan Winship > On 08/12/2010 01:56 PM, Pi=F1eiro wrote: >> After thinking a little about it, I realize that this .get_name that= >> is being called is atk_action_get_name [2], as this class implements= >> AtkAction interface. > = >> Although I tried some (random) ways to call atk_object_get_name on >> this object, I was not able to do that. >> = >> Any idea or hint? > = > hm... try Atk.Object.prototype.get_name.call(atk_label) ? Just tested. Doesn't work. It says that call is not defined. Anyway, I tested this: >>> Atk.Object.prototype.get_name (atk_label) And returns NULL, what it is wrong as the object has a name. Although it call the method, it fails in this atk_object_get_name check: g_return_val_if_fail (ATK_IS_OBJECT (accessible), NULL); Launching the g_return_val_if_fail warning. So I guess that atk_label is not valid as a real AtkObject, after all it is a proxy: >>> atk_label =3D label.get_accessible () r (2) =3D [object instance proxy GIName:Atk.GObjectAccessible jsobj@0x= XXXXXX native@0xXXXXXXX] There is any way to call this method using the real AtkObject instance? Anyway, although we get that, that doesn't seems a really clean way to call this method, and not really general. Although enough if we don't find too many cases (see below, last paragraph). > That assumes AtkLabel isn't overriding AtkObjectClass->get_name... if= it > is, I don't think there's any way in gjs to refer to AtkLabel's > implementation of the method. Well, sorry, there isn't any AtkLabel class/interface. I guess that you are talking about AtkAction. No, AtkAction is not overriding AtkObjectClass->get_name. CallyActor class is an AtkObjectClass that implements AtkAction (so implementing AtkAction->get_name). StallyLabel [1] is overriding AtkObject->get_name. But AtkAction->get_name is not overriding AtkObject->get_name. Because if not, this problem would also arise in the "C World" calling atk_object_get_name, not just using javascript. And also, take into account that the signature is different. atk_object_get_name just receives the instance. atk_action_get_name receives the instance and a gint, as it returns the name of the nth action of this atkobject. > Does this work usefully in other language bindings? I think this is j= ust > considered bad class design, and the answer is "don't do that then"..= .= You mean trying Atk with python, for example? I haven't tested it. Also, you mean that AtkAction shouldn't have a method ->get_name because AtkObject has already a method called in the same way? Well, after thinking a little about it, and comparing it with other languages, probably it is true, although just in the automatic bindings world. I mean that this wasn't a problem at all until now. Probably this atk_action_get_name can be called atk_action_get_action_name, as it is requesting the name of a specific action. But it sound redundant when you are just using C. Finally, take into account that I was working without problem with Atk until I found this problem, so not sure how many methods are affected. Probably I should require to check if there are other methods in the different interfaces with this problem. Thanks for your hints. BR [1] https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3D626658 =3D=3D=3D API (apinheiro@igalia.com) From danw@gnome.org Fri Aug 13 17:44:32 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DCBE750101 for ; Fri, 13 Aug 2010 17:44:32 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.823 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.823 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, TW_GJ=0.077] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ix1Gdcc4g2H4 for ; Fri, 13 Aug 2010 17:44:30 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mysterion.org (mysterion.org [69.25.196.35]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 559D77500CD for ; Fri, 13 Aug 2010 17:44:21 +0000 (UTC) Received: from desktop.home.mysterion.org (c-76-97-71-164.hsd1.ga.comcast.net [76.97.71.164]) by mysterion.org (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 17CB2802AE; Fri, 13 Aug 2010 13:44:20 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4C658470.2050700@gnome.org> Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2010 13:44:16 -0400 From: Dan Winship User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux x86_64; en-US; rv:1.9.2.7) Gecko/20100720 Fedora/3.1.1-1.fc13 Thunderbird/3.1.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Pi=F1eiro?= Subject: Re: Some issues calling atk methods References: <20100812.195638.88382342.apinheiro@igalia.com> <4C6564E7.3080307@gnome.org> <20100813.190442.200288960.apinheiro@igalia.com> In-Reply-To: <20100813.190442.200288960.apinheiro@igalia.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2010 17:44:32 -0000 On 08/13/2010 01:04 PM, Pi�eiro wrote: >> hm... try Atk.Object.prototype.get_name.call(atk_label) ? > > Just tested. Doesn't work. It says that call is not defined. ah... because introspection functions aren't JS Function objects... > Anyway, I > tested this: > > >>> Atk.Object.prototype.get_name (atk_label) > > And returns NULL, what it is wrong as the object has a name. Although > it call the method, it fails in this atk_object_get_name check: > > g_return_val_if_fail (ATK_IS_OBJECT (accessible), NULL); > > Launching the g_return_val_if_fail warning. So I guess that atk_label > is not valid as a real AtkObject no, the atk_label argument is just being ignored: you'll get the same error if you call "Atk.Object.prototype.get_name()" with no argument. The problem is that it's passing "Atk.Object.prototype" as the argument to atk_object_get_name(), and that's a JavaScript internal object, not an AtkObject instance. > after all it is a proxy: > > >>> atk_label = label.get_accessible () > r (2) = [object instance proxy GIName:Atk.GObjectAccessible jsobj@0xXXXXXX native@0xXXXXXXX] > > There is any way to call this method using the real AtkObject > instance? gjs automatically translates between JS proxies and underlying GObjects as needed. >> That assumes AtkLabel isn't overriding AtkObjectClass->get_name... if it >> is, I don't think there's any way in gjs to refer to AtkLabel's >> implementation of the method. > > Well, sorry, there isn't any AtkLabel class/interface. I guess that > you are talking about AtkAction. Oh, no, I meant StallyLabel. If stally_label_get_class() was overriding atk_object_class->get_name, then there'd be no way to access that method from gjs. Not that this matters at this point since there isn't even any way to get the original AtkObject get_name method either. Probably the easiest solution for now is to just add a C method "shell_get_accessible_name (AtkObject *obj)" or something, that calls atk_object_get_name(obj), and then you can use "Shell.get_accessible_name(atk_label)" from JS. -- Dan From mnovenstern@students.colgate.edu Sun Aug 15 21:48:42 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 932487508F5; Sun, 15 Aug 2010 21:48:42 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.823 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.823 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, TW_JH=0.077] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id m9MpDMjftNcF; Sun, 15 Aug 2010 21:48:39 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-qw0-f54.google.com (mail-qw0-f54.google.com [209.85.216.54]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 303BD7508EC; Sun, 15 Aug 2010 21:48:30 +0000 (UTC) Received: by qwg5 with SMTP id 5so5514287qwg.27 for ; Sun, 15 Aug 2010 14:48:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.229.37.1 with SMTP id v1mr30890qcd.170.1281908909354; Sun, 15 Aug 2010 14:48:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.0.1.5] (ool-44c69626.dyn.optonline.net [68.198.150.38]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id n6sm6477975qcu.43.2010.08.15.14.48.28 (version=SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Sun, 15 Aug 2010 14:48:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Message Tray Week 12 From: Matt Novenstern To: gnome-soc-list , gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2010 17:48:30 -0400 Message-ID: <1281908910.8023.104.camel@clam> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.30.2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2010 21:48:42 -0000 Hello again, This week has been one for fixing up things that I'd been working on to get things pushed to git, unfortunately, the jhbuild of gnome shell is broken as of a few days ago, and I found out by trying to update. That means that, while I've been trying to update things, I can't test any of my fixing and therefore haven't gotten to post updated patches. As soon as I find out that the build gets fixed, I'll be sending things along and bothering people about getting them in, but right now I'm pretty dead in the water. I plan to continue trying to continue to gnome shell, so, this isn't a goodbye. I'll be cleaning up my page on the gnome wiki as per daniel's reminder and I'm usually in #gnome-shell and #rhythmbox on IRC. -Matt From apinheiro@igalia.com Mon Aug 16 11:53:54 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F14175023B for ; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 11:53:54 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.744 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.744 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_NEUTRAL=0.779, TW_GJ=0.077] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4puKdb35RXVm for ; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 11:53:50 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp4.mundo-r.com (smtp4.mundo-r.com [212.51.32.151]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4DFF7500F6 for ; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 11:53:41 +0000 (UTC) X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AhUFAPLDaExbdWOb/2dsb2JhbACTMI4CuWCFOwSJYg X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.55,375,1278280800"; d="scan'208";a="669698853" Received: from 155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com (HELO fanzine.igalia.com) ([91.117.99.155]) by smtp4.mundo-r.com with ESMTP; 16 Aug 2010 13:53:36 +0200 Received: from maestria.local.igalia.com ([192.168.10.14] helo=mail.igalia.com) by fanzine.igalia.com with esmtps (Cipher TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim) id 1OkyG0-00069z-Em for ; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 13:53:36 +0200 Received: from ip154.dynamic.igalia.com ([192.168.10.154] helo=remigio) by mail.igalia.com with esmtps (Cipher TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim) id 1OkyG0-0006Ds-4S for ; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 13:53:36 +0200 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by remigio with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1OkyG0-0001hI-0k for gnome-shell-list@gnome.org; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 13:53:36 +0200 Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 13:53:35 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <20100816.135335.166778481.apinheiro@igalia.com> To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Subject: Re: Some issues calling atk methods From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Pi=F1eiro?= In-Reply-To: <4C658470.2050700@gnome.org> References: <4C6564E7.3080307@gnome.org> <20100813.190442.200288960.apinheiro@igalia.com> <4C658470.2050700@gnome.org> X-Mailer: Mew version 6.3 on Emacs 23.1 / Mule 6.0 (HANACHIRUSATO) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 11:53:54 -0000 From: Dan Winship > On 08/13/2010 01:04 PM, Pi=F1eiro wrote: >>> hm... try Atk.Object.prototype.get_name.call(atk_label) ? >> = >> Just tested. Doesn't work. It says that call is not defined. > = > ah... because introspection functions aren't JS Function objects... Ok >> Launching the g_return_val_if_fail warning. So I guess that atk_labe= l >> is not valid as a real AtkObject > = > no, the atk_label argument is just being ignored: you'll get the same= > error if you call "Atk.Object.prototype.get_name()" with no argument.= > The problem is that it's passing "Atk.Object.prototype" as the argume= nt > to atk_object_get_name(), and that's a JavaScript internal object, no= t > an AtkObject instance. Ok >>> That assumes AtkLabel isn't overriding AtkObjectClass->get_name... = if it >>> is, I don't think there's any way in gjs to refer to AtkLabel's >>> implementation of the method. >> = >> Well, sorry, there isn't any AtkLabel class/interface. I guess that >> you are talking about AtkAction. > = > Oh, no, I meant StallyLabel. If stally_label_get_class() was overridi= ng > atk_object_class->get_name, then there'd be no way to access that met= hod > from gjs. Not that this matters at this point since there isn't even = any > way to get the original AtkObject get_name method either. Ok, sorry for the misunderstanding. Yes, StallyLabel overrides get_name (I'm using my patch here [1]). > Probably the easiest solution for now is to just add a C method > "shell_get_accessible_name (AtkObject *obj)" or something, that calls= > atk_object_get_name(obj), and then you can use > "Shell.get_accessible_name(atk_label)" from JS. Well, as I said in my original mail, I found this issue making some tests, in fact testing that my patch [1] was working. But right now I don't need to call atk_object_get_name, but I found that I can't call it making that tests. The purpose of the mail were check if there are a way to call it, as I still need to check if this problem affects to other ATK methods. As in the end there are no way to do that, and in order to found workarounds, I search a little on AtkObject, and the name is also exported as a property [2]. I have used it and works with problem. Thanks for all your help, and hints. BTW: you still thinks that this is a problem with ATK, in the sense of a bad name-policy? [1] https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3D626658 [2] http://library.gnome.org/devel/atk/stable/AtkObject.html#AtkObject-= -accessible-name BR =3D=3D=3D API (apinheiro@igalia.com) From apinheiro@igalia.com Mon Aug 16 14:01:25 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4058F7501D9 for ; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 14:01:25 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.821 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.821 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_NEUTRAL=0.779] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wjWOMLunQZYL for ; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 14:01:21 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp4.mundo-r.com (smtp4.mundo-r.com [212.51.32.151]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7356F75022F for ; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 14:01:12 +0000 (UTC) X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AhUFALfhaExbdWOb/2dsb2JhbACTMI4Du3eFOwSJYg X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.55,376,1278280800"; d="scan'208";a="672093470" Received: from 155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com (HELO fanzine.igalia.com) ([91.117.99.155]) by smtp4.mundo-r.com with ESMTP; 16 Aug 2010 16:01:08 +0200 Received: from maestria.local.igalia.com ([192.168.10.14] helo=mail.igalia.com) by fanzine.igalia.com with esmtps (Cipher TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim) id 1Ol0FQ-0007sc-0k for ; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 16:01:08 +0200 Received: from ip154.dynamic.igalia.com ([192.168.10.154] helo=remigio) by mail.igalia.com with esmtps (Cipher TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim) id 1Ol0FP-00039t-Qm for ; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 16:01:07 +0200 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by remigio with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Ol0FP-0001x7-QQ for gnome-shell-list@gnome.org; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 16:01:07 +0200 Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 16:01:07 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <20100816.160107.145035307.apinheiro@igalia.com> To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Subject: Re: Some issues calling atk methods From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Pi=F1eiro?= In-Reply-To: <20100816.135335.166778481.apinheiro@igalia.com> References: <20100813.190442.200288960.apinheiro@igalia.com> <4C658470.2050700@gnome.org> <20100816.135335.166778481.apinheiro@igalia.com> X-Mailer: Mew version 6.3 on Emacs 23.1 / Mule 6.0 (HANACHIRUSATO) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 14:01:25 -0000 From: Pi=F1eiro > As in the end there are no way to do that, and in order to found > workarounds, I search a little on AtkObject, and the name is also > exported as a property [2]. I have used it and works with problem. ^^^^ without Sorry for the noise. =3D=3D=3D API (apinheiro@igalia.com) From danw@gnome.org Mon Aug 16 16:47:14 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3AE0750196 for ; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 16:47:14 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gA8dSa7jLS4R for ; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 16:47:11 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mysterion.org (mysterion.org [69.25.196.35]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7689F75012D for ; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 16:47:02 +0000 (UTC) Received: from desktop.home.mysterion.org (c-76-97-71-164.hsd1.ga.comcast.net [76.97.71.164]) by mysterion.org (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 108F0802AE; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 12:47:01 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4C696B82.3030106@gnome.org> Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 12:46:58 -0400 From: Dan Winship User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux x86_64; en-US; rv:1.9.2.7) Gecko/20100720 Fedora/3.1.1-1.fc13 Thunderbird/3.1.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Pi=F1eiro?= Subject: Re: Some issues calling atk methods References: <4C6564E7.3080307@gnome.org> <20100813.190442.200288960.apinheiro@igalia.com> <4C658470.2050700@gnome.org> <20100816.135335.166778481.apinheiro@igalia.com> In-Reply-To: <20100816.135335.166778481.apinheiro@igalia.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 16:47:15 -0000 On 08/16/2010 07:53 AM, Pi�eiro wrote: > BTW: you still thinks that this is a problem with ATK, in the sense of > a bad name-policy? Yes. Most languages/bindings other than C are going to run into that same problem with one of the two get_name() methods shadowing the other. It would be good to deprecate one of them and rename it to something else. -- Dan From sbrady@gtfservices.com Mon Aug 16 21:52:09 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A45327500FE for ; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 21:52:09 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id osdxr5+MOvUG for ; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 21:52:01 +0000 (UTC) Received: from EXHUB017-4.exch017.msoutlookonline.net (exhub017-4.exch017.msoutlookonline.net [64.78.22.19]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C99F77502A3 for ; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 21:51:53 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [192.168.2.235] (24.8.50.199) by smtpx17.msoutlookonline.net (64.78.22.39) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.2.234.1; Mon, 16 Aug 2010 14:51:51 -0700 Message-ID: <4C69B2F6.4030406@gtfservices.com> Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 15:51:50 -0600 From: Sean Brady Organization: GTF Services LLC User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux x86_64; en-US; rv:1.9.2.7) Gecko/20100720 Fedora/3.1.1-1.fc13 Lightning/1.0b2pre Thunderbird/3.1.1 ThunderBrowse/3.3.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "gnome-shell-list@gnome.org" Subject: Suggestion: Make the tiled/ single workspace toggle button bigger Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list Reply-To: sbrady@gtfservices.com List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 21:52:09 -0000 I don't know what you call that UI widget, but it's the one that changes the overlay's workspace view from single workspace to all workspaces tiled. I think that should be bigger and/or easier to get to. It might be better to move it close to the bottom right instead of the left (right under the plus and minus for the workspaces) and much longer (like a spacebar). I have found that I am using fullscreen view in apps more and more, because I have that great little button to switch between workspaces and workspace view if when need to. I am also keeping more workspaces open and using more of them as well, separating them by task. Another suggestion would be to have an application's window appear on multiple discreet workspaces simultaneously. For example, Firefox on workspaces 1, 3 and 4 but not workspaces 2 and 5-8. Not sure how that would be done, but it's something to think about. Thanks all... Sean From apinheiro@igalia.com Wed Aug 18 16:33:11 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19B537508B3; Wed, 18 Aug 2010 16:33:11 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.59 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.59 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_NEUTRAL=0.779, TW_GT=0.077, TW_XF=0.077, TW_YG=0.077] autolearn=no Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gws+nxfs+cZo; Wed, 18 Aug 2010 16:33:07 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp4.mundo-r.com (smtp4.mundo-r.com [212.51.32.151]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B374750865; Wed, 18 Aug 2010 16:32:58 +0000 (UTC) X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: An8GAKKna0xbdWOb/2dsb2JhbACDFJAdjgvAYoU3BIlt X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.56,228,1280700000"; d="py'?scan'208";a="670532957" Received: from 155.99.117.91.static.mundo-r.com (HELO fanzine.igalia.com) ([91.117.99.155]) by smtp4.mundo-r.com with ESMTP; 18 Aug 2010 18:32:55 +0200 Received: from maestria.local.igalia.com ([192.168.10.14] helo=mail.igalia.com) by fanzine.igalia.com with esmtps (Cipher TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim) id 1OllZP-0007Zp-VB; Wed, 18 Aug 2010 18:32:55 +0200 Received: from ip154.dynamic.igalia.com ([192.168.10.154] helo=remigio) by mail.igalia.com with esmtps (Cipher TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim) id 1OllZP-0001nX-L5; Wed, 18 Aug 2010 18:32:55 +0200 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by remigio with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1OllZP-0002J8-Mc; Wed, 18 Aug 2010 18:32:55 +0200 Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2010 18:32:55 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <20100818.183255.257865758.apinheiro@igalia.com> To: danw@gnome.org Subject: Re: Some issues calling atk methods From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Pi=F1eiro?= In-Reply-To: <4C6564E7.3080307@gnome.org> References: <20100812.195638.88382342.apinheiro@igalia.com> <4C6564E7.3080307@gnome.org> X-Mailer: Mew version 6.3 on Emacs 23.1 / Mule 6.0 (HANACHIRUSATO) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; boundary="--Next_Part(Wed_Aug_18_18_32_55_2010_430)--" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-BeenThere: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.13 Precedence: list List-Id: Next generation GNOME desktop shell List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2010 16:33:11 -0000 ----Next_Part(Wed_Aug_18_18_32_55_2010_430)-- Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Dan Winship JFYI > Does this work usefully in other language bindings? I think this is just > considered bad class design, and the answer is "don't do that then"... Although the thread is over, to fullfill my curiosity, I was testing this issue with python. Although initially I have a weird problem (importing pyatspi causes a problem with mixed python bindings) I was able to get it working. In this case, if you call atk_label.get_name, you call the AtkObject one. In the same way, get_name doesn't appear as a method inherited from AtkAction. Probably this is because the method resolution order: | Method resolution order: | __main__.CallyText | __main__.CallyActor | gi.repository.Atk.GObjectAccessible | gi.repository.Atk.Object | gobject._gobject.GObject | gi.repository.Atk.Component | gi.repository.Atk.Action | gi.repository.Atk.Text | gi.repository.Atk.EditableText | gobject.GInterface | __builtin__.object So in this case you can't call AtkAction.get_name calling atk_label.get_action (0). So the overlap issue is still there. But in this case you can do the following to workaround that: Atk.Action.get_name (atk_label, 0) and obviously, call AtkObject one using this: Atk.Object.get_name (atk_label) Silly test attached. BR === API (apinheiro@igalia.com) ----Next_Part(Wed_Aug_18_18_32_55_2010_430)-- Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="test_atk_object_get_name.py" #!/usr/bin/env python # Testing if python have the same problem with overlapped # ->get_name methods (AtkObject and AtkAction) # More info here: # http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnome-shell-list/2010-August/msg00017.html # # How to use pygi from: # http://live.gnome.org/PyGObject # # Author: Alejandro Pinheiro #import pyatspi don't import this!! or you would load manual python bindings, and the example will not work import pygtk pygtk.require ('2.0') # adds gi to the pythonpath from gi.repository import Clutter from gi.repository import Atk def key_press_cb (self, event, label): atk_label = label.get_accessible () name = atk_label.get_name () name_using_class = Atk.Object.get_name (atk_label) action_name = Atk.Action.get_name (atk_label, 0) print "label name: " + name print "label name using class: " + name_using_class print "label action 0 name: " + action_name if __name__ == "__main__": Clutter.init (None) color = Clutter.Color () color.red = 0xff color.green = 0x00 color.blue = 0x00 color.alpha = 0xff label = Clutter.Text () label.set_text ("Some text") label.set_font_name ("Sans Bold 32px") label.set_color (color) s = Clutter.Stage () s.title = 'Overlapping methods' s.set_size (600, 200) s.connect ('destroy', lambda x: Clutter.main_quit()) s.connect ('button-press-event', key_press_cb, label); s.add_actor (label) s.show_all () Clutter.main () ----Next_Part(Wed_Aug_18_18_32_55_2010_430)---- From sloshy45@sbcglobal.net Mon Aug 23 03:24:34 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Delivered-To: gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9760D7500B8 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2010 03:24:34 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at gnome.org X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=2 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001] autolearn=ham Received: from menubar.gnome.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (menubar.gnome.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AB7qjSYpovW9 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2010 03:24:32 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp103.sbc.mail.re3.yahoo.com (smtp103.sbc.mail.re3.yahoo.com [66.196.96.86]) by menubar.gnome.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 87ECF750004 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2010 03:24:23 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 16812 invoked from network); 23 Aug 2010 03:24:22 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=sbcglobal.net; h=DKIM-Signature:Received:X-Yahoo-SMTP:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=bbM6oJNUE5XVcu1OuZNUHoKA7vTIQVSBn3RmGfwjsIZlGw7mCb03z4udFUyEV19iDh6JtMTG7d0DjUnwjyEgm1bH4hPLR2mT1jDsJBQV+qFMx2u9ULlUE/g5DDX6H6nBOMsxrTdrizbe/ZEd7V2/TYxQzxhVyqJwB+7P0QWA6Ns= ; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=sbcglobal.net; s=s1024; t=1282533862; bh=ry3KTq9XTms/WNFyMUioxxQ1n6D1W31QSaz6kr6HyBQ=; h=Received:X-Yahoo-SMTP:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=Jl88wOXqBDrLnuon6zefjpfz9EXJ6d469QjMZfD6dCM7uyFptSgUJ23lC8zUOnGpl6D/TFxuLQt9fVRD8wYGHHi9AI/E3lYYMJim4LEvNbV4G6pNpJgli1rHvT4Jvy8juP2RC0bqQyCNXR16M4VE1izXjEgQoGFKsTLMZu0OWFA= Received: from [192.168.1.118] (sloshy45@76.197.132.118 with plain) by smtp103.sbc.mail.re3.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Aug 2010 20:24:22 -0700 PDT X-Yahoo-SMTP: OhstvuiswBBz7FeX8HKAFDd.RuNJU6P8idCqCh6OCFkheW0- X-YMail-OSG: ayQqTjEVM1kcvlp8_hC2BCtxzw4ccBrWaVizUOWBYpanHGP bBL728QU_LwH0aoLd..KXPSOoaSjSMkvu5.5I7Vc7u8ykWlVE5B_5dsovzCv urPHWyUWlBQKN9pzGlLLyIxGtcspfB7.xXl1kuuGthUBoPXYw71hG3w0V7ni T.XvDTwf0sTrDiMPhqOShaDUWKZrAOD5CAxDpMeCbc94gaUz4cgNlYyeuWQH DfpDKFfJ9_fXsRf.WoUO56lvxK6ZzYR8UOrhRSTY4EJ4R3Huu5MTbe7atynY .8wc_3FTN4tahTpJSefB1wdRPOMZVHB69_fILCH.FrxQhxQ2IC_4IA3_ocAK 2sQed9QFYviWcoEdBDCxZPC0pZX22tgPHZQ-- X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Message-ID: <4C71E9E4.9020608@sbcglobal.net> Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2010 22:24:20 -0500 From: Ryan Peters User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.9.2.8) Gecko/20100806 Lanikai/3.1.2 ThunderBrowse/3.3.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Kyle Baker , gnome-shell-list@gnome.org Subject: Re: [Rhythmbox-devel] Rhythmbox 0.13.0 crashes when I toggle Shuffle mode References: