Re: [Helix Updates] GNOME 1.0"Bongo GNOME" Now Available -- Convince me!!!!!!

[Gustav Schaffter <gustav schaffter com>]

Dear Mr. Zone.


First of all, it was never my intention to be rude. If any of the
developers were upset about my question I ask him/her to please accept
my apology.

I've had several answers to my question, that all were very helpful in
pointing me not only to a few alternative places to do downloads of RH
packaged Helix RPMS, but also with alternative ways of retrieving the
Helix Gnome in a way that is both convenient and efficient for my
situation.

Please, do not believe for one second that I underestimate the time and
efforts provided, for free, by the developers of this code (and almost
any other Linux code). As I mentioned, I'm a developer myself, even
though I currently do not find time to develop on my free time, so I
actually *do* understand the effort.

Data, please read my comments further down as well.

Data Zone wrote:
<snip>

> Since i have not seen you paying any of the gnome developers money to
> develop software, i don't think you should be making demands like this.

Data, my demand was twofold.
1) "Please, tell me that I'm blind and didn't see/find the real download
spot"...
I'm not accusing anyone but myself. Consequently, I received at least
two answers indicating that I was blind not to find what I was looking
for. Including instructions of how to find it...

2) "Please, convince me (in any your way) that I should stick to Gnome."
There are other desktop managers. I like Gnome. It didn't take a lot for
at least two different people to convince me the stick to Gnome.

> it is very rude, and cause people to feel like their work is
> unappreciated.

I honestly fail to see what was rude. (Though 'rude' is of course a
question of personal appreciation.) I said (with many words) that I
failed to find a download spot where I could do a binary download. I was
told where to find it. I asked people to convince me not to 'switchdesk'
and I had a quick response that convinced me.

One may argue that I accused the author of the Website for not having
been very clear as to where the binary download was to be found. I
agree. I don't think that was *so* rude. If so, I ask the Webmaster to
apologize me.
One may also argue that it was rude of me to *assume* that there should
be a binary package to download. Well, that's the way it almost always
is. It's somewhat become a habit to look for binary packages. Guess I'm
spoiled.


>  i suggest you appoligise to all the gnome developers at
> once.

To make sure that no one else interpret my message in this negative way;
Done. And I do it again.

> It is not up to the developers to provide nice and cute packaging for end
> users, it would be great, but it is asking too much.

It is great (and appreciated) when it happens. It cannot be *demanded*,
as can nothing be *demanded* in the world of free software.

It is a very common way of bringing more users to the Linux world,
though. (I mean to make Linux 'user friendly'.) Most future Linux users
will *not* be able to/want to compile their own source code to binaries.

I believe that most people see the advantages with many new Linux users.
Of course, there is a flip side to the coin. Many new users will
*accuse* the Linux community for glitches and imperfections, instead of
asking themselves if they want to stay with a software package or go
another way. Or asking people to help them find what they're looking
for.


> You should be sending this email to RedHat, (if you purchased their
> software)

Redhat doesn't answer for the Helix project. They've included versions
of Gnome for more than a year. But they will only take responsibility
for the .rpms that they package. As I guess the Helix developers will
take (at least limited) responsibility for the packages they provide.

And, by the way, I *did* buy the distro from RedHat. (Just for the
records.)

> or to helix, but not here (or at least a littl enicer.)
Well, my first message was in response to the announcement of the new
Helix availability. I read it here. And I responded here. Don't really
see how that could be wrong. Please, enlighten me.


> If you think i am being a little harsh, then tough, thats how i would
> feel if i spent hours working on code for others for free, and then read
> this.  but since most developers are too nice to say this for themselves,
> i will gladly say this for them.

'Most developers' sent me several helpful and instructive responses. I
may or may not have deserved that, but at least those who answered me
with download instructions didn't seem to be too disturbed by my two
questions.

<snip>

Oh, oh. Now I see it clearly. I believe I understand what upset you. I
said:
"What I want, is to do a download of a binary package for RedHat to my
server and then install it in as many boxes as I want."

That wasn't very humble of me. To whom it may concern, I sincerely would
like to rephrase that to:
"What I would wish, is to do a download of a binary package for RedHat
to my server and then install it in as many boxes as I want."

I sincerely ask you to apologize that way of requesting things. Won't
happen again.


Best regards
Gustav


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